Saron Yitbarek: The Balance Between Maintainable Code and Multiple Streams of Income

Maintainable

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36:51

Traditional banks often lack personalized service, and local businesses struggle to find true partnership in financial institutions. Meanwhile, higher education faces scrutiny over relevance and ROI in a world where information is nearly free. Harry Allen helped launch Studio Bank to blend technology with high-touch service, fueled by community investment. At Belmont, he's applying the same entrepreneurial mindset to modernize university operations and embed practical learning experiences, like a one-of-a-kind partnership with Dolly Parton, into academia. In this episode, Harry L. Allen, co-founder of Studio Bank and now CFO at Belmont University, unpacks the bold vision behind launching a community-first bank in a city dominated by financial giants. He shares the leadership lessons that shaped his journey, how to lead through crisis, and why mentorship is the key to filling today's leadership vacuum. Key Takeaways Leveraging both financial and social capital creates a unique, community-first banking model. High-tech doesn't mean low-touch, Studio Bank fused innovation with personal relationships. Leadership means showing up, especially during crisis. Universities must shift from being information hubs to delivering real-world experience. Succession and mentorship are vital to cultivating the next generation of leaders. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Harry L. Allen 01:49 The Birth of Studio Bank 04:29 Leveraging Technology in Community Banking 07:25 The Courage to Start a New Venture 10:37 Leadership Challenges in High Growth 13:02 Leading Through Crisis: The COVID Experience 17:55 Transitioning from Banking to Education 21:16 The Role of Leadership in Higher Education 25:16 Adapting to Challenges in Higher Education 30:04 The Leadership Vacuum in Society 33:17 Advice for Emerging Leaders 35:21 The American Dream and Community Impact No Limit Leadership is the go-to podcast for growth-minded executives, middle managers, and team leaders who want more than surface-level leadership advice. Hosted by executive coach and former Special Forces commander Sean Patton, this show dives deep into modern leadership, self-leadership, and the real-world strategies that build high-performing teams. Whether you're focused on leadership development, building a coaching culture, improving leadership communication, or strengthening team accountability, each episode equips you with actionable insights to unlock leadership potential across your organization. From designing onboarding systems that retain talent to asking better questions that drive clarity and impact, No Limit Leadership helps you lead yourself first so you can lead others better. If you're ready to create a culture of ownership, resilience, and results, this leadership podcast is for you.…

about a year ago 41:20

MP3•Episode home

Episode Highlights

[00:05:32] Introduction to Saron's Background: Robby and Saron discuss her startup, DiscoLink, and the initial development of its MVP.
[00:10:50] The Importance of Context in Code: Saron emphasizes why understanding the business decisions behind code is crucial for maintainability.
[00:15:10] Onboarding a New Developer: Saron shares her experience hiring her first developer and how it changed her approach to software maintenance.
[00:20:32] Multiple Streams of Income: Saron explains her motivation behind building DiscoLink to help professionals manage different revenue streams.
[00:25:40] Transparency Around Money: A candid conversation about developers’ fears around charging for their work and how to overcome them.
[00:30:45] Ethics and Side Projects: Robby and Saron discuss ethical considerations when working on side projects while employed full-time.
[00:35:12] How Podcasting Shaped Saron's Career: Saron talks about how being a podcast host impacted her career growth and networking.

Key Takeaways

Maintainability Beyond Code: Saron highlights the importance of documenting not just the code but also the business rationale behind decisions.
Onboarding Challenges: Bringing a new developer into a solo-built project requires strong communication, context sharing, and flexible documentation practices.
The Power of Multiple Income Streams: Saron’s vision with DiscoLink focuses on helping tech professionals build financial security through various revenue channels.
Confronting Money Anxiety: Many developers struggle with charging for their work, but transparency and community conversations help break down those barriers.
Ethical Side Projects: It's important to consider the ethical implications of using work-learned skills for personal projects.

Resources

Saron Yitbarek on LinkedIn
Saron Yitbarek on Twitter
DiscoLink Website
Book Recommendation: Formerly Known as Food by Kristin Lawless

Links:

My newsletter: https://themultihyphenate.ck.page/newsletter

Thanks to Our Sponsor!

Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks.

It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications.

Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time!

Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out!

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214 episodes

#Tech #Careers #Business #Robby Russell #Software Development #Software #Agile #Programming #Technical Debt #Best Practices #Web Development #Legacy Code #Software Engineering #Software Programming #Code #Software Code

Saron Yitbarek: The Balance Between Maintainable Code and Multiple Streams of Income

Maintainable

27 subscribers

published about a year ago

MP3•Episode home

Episode Highlights

[00:05:32] Introduction to Saron's Background: Robby and Saron discuss her startup, DiscoLink, and the initial development of its MVP.
[00:10:50] The Importance of Context in Code: Saron emphasizes why understanding the business decisions behind code is crucial for maintainability.
[00:15:10] Onboarding a New Developer: Saron shares her experience hiring her first developer and how it changed her approach to software maintenance.
[00:20:32] Multiple Streams of Income: Saron explains her motivation behind building DiscoLink to help professionals manage different revenue streams.
[00:25:40] Transparency Around Money: A candid conversation about developers’ fears around charging for their work and how to overcome them.
[00:30:45] Ethics and Side Projects: Robby and Saron discuss ethical considerations when working on side projects while employed full-time.
[00:35:12] How Podcasting Shaped Saron's Career: Saron talks about how being a podcast host impacted her career growth and networking.

Key Takeaways

Maintainability Beyond Code: Saron highlights the importance of documenting not just the code but also the business rationale behind decisions.
Onboarding Challenges: Bringing a new developer into a solo-built project requires strong communication, context sharing, and flexible documentation practices.
The Power of Multiple Income Streams: Saron’s vision with DiscoLink focuses on helping tech professionals build financial security through various revenue channels.
Confronting Money Anxiety: Many developers struggle with charging for their work, but transparency and community conversations help break down those barriers.
Ethical Side Projects: It's important to consider the ethical implications of using work-learned skills for personal projects.

Resources

Saron Yitbarek on LinkedIn
Saron Yitbarek on Twitter
DiscoLink Website
Book Recommendation: Formerly Known as Food by Kristin Lawless

Links:

My newsletter: https://themultihyphenate.ck.page/newsletter

Thanks to Our Sponsor!

Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks.

It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications.

Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time!

Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out!

Subscribe to Maintainable on:

Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts.

Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.

214 episodes

All episodes

Maintainable

1
Joel Chippindale: Why High-Quality Software Isn’t About Developer Skill Alone 56:39

13 days ago56:39

56:39

CTO coach Joel Chippindale joins Robby to share what he's learned over two decades of building and leading software teams. Joel argues that maintainability has less to do with “clean code” and more to do with how teams communicate, prioritize, and make progress visible. Drawing on his time at Unmade and his current coaching practice, Joel outlines practical ways teams can build trust, navigate brittle systems, and stop letting technical debt conversations get lost in translation. Episode Highlights [00:01:10] A Working Definition of Maintainability Joel explains why “software that’s easy to keep changing” is the gold standard—and why context matters as much as code. [00:05:24] The Pitfalls of Pre-Optimization How developers can trap themselves by designing for futures that may never arrive. [00:10:40] Challenging the Iron Triangle Joel pushes back on the idea that teams must sacrifice quality for speed or cost. [00:15:31] Quality Is a Team Conversation Why code quality starts long before you open your editor. [00:20:00] Unmade Case Study: From Chaos to Confidence How Joel helped a struggling team at Unmade regain trust by delivering less—and showing more. [00:28:08] Helping Business Stakeholders Buy Into Maintenance Work How to reframe backend investments in terms that resonate across departments. [00:33:40] First Steps for Fragile Systems What Joel looks for when coaching teams overwhelmed by legacy code. [00:41:32] The Value of Boring Technology Why solving real problems matters more than chasing resume polish. [00:45:20] The Case for Coaching What makes leadership coaching valuable—and why it's not a sign of weakness. [00:51:10] Building Your Manager Voltron Joel shares why every developer should cultivate their own support system, including mentors, peers, and coaches. Resources & Mentions Joel’s Coaching Site – Monkey’s Thumb Joel on Mastodon “Take Back Control of Code Quality” – Joel’s Blog Post “Manager Voltron” by Lara Hogan Never Split the Difference by Chris Voss Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Melanie Sumner: Why Continuous Accessibility Is a Strategic Advantage 49:30

5 weeks ago49:30

49:30

Melanie Sumner: Why Continuous Accessibility Is a Strategic Advantage Melanie Sumner, Product Accessibility Lead for Design Systems at HashiCorp , joins Robby to talk about what it takes to scale accessibility across legacy products—and how aligning design and engineering processes creates lasting change. Melanie shares her work making Ember.js more accessible, her team’s philosophy behind their design system, and why she treats accessibility like any other technical concern. From the pitfalls of nested interactive elements to the strengths of Ember's conventions and codemods, this conversation offers a roadmap for integrating accessibility into every layer of product development. Melanie also reflects on why she trademarked the term Continuous Accessibility , how it fits into product lifecycles, and what other frameworks can learn from the Ember community’s approach. “Accessibility is a technical problem with a technical solution.” Melanie joins us from Chicago, Illinois. Episode Highlights [00:01:00] What Well-Maintained Software Looks Like: Consistency, purpose, and bridging design and engineering [00:02:30] Building a Unified Design System Across 10+ Legacy Products [00:03:30] Creating Component Requirements Before Design or Code [00:05:00] Designing with Accessibility Defaults—and Providing Bridges for Legacy [00:07:00] How Ember’s Conventions Help Scale Front-End Systems [00:09:30] Who Uses Ember—and Why It's a Fit for Teams with Big Requirements [00:13:30] Technical Debt in Design Systems and the Cost of Rushing [00:16:30] How They Future-Proof Components and Avoid Over-Engineering [00:19:00] What “Continuous Accessibility” Means in Practice [00:21:00] Accessibility Testing and the Limits of Automation [00:23:00] Common Accessibility Mistakes: Nested Interactives and Misused DIVs [00:24:30] Keyboard Navigation as a Litmus Test [00:26:00] Text Adventure Games and Accessibility as a Playable Experience [00:28:30] The Origin of Her Accessibility Journey at UNC Chapel Hill [00:31:00] Why She Avoids Framing Accessibility in Emotional Terms [00:32:45] Compliance as a Business Driver for Accessibility [00:35:00] Open Source Work on Testing Rules Across Frameworks [00:38:00] The Navigation API and Fixing Single-Page App Accessibility [00:40:30] HTML’s Forgiveness and the Illusion of “Good Enough” [00:43:00] Advice for Engineers Advocating for Accessibility Without Authority [00:46:45] Book Recommendation: Cradle Series by Will Wight [00:48:30] Where to Follow Melanie: melanie.codes Links and Resources Melanie's Website Helios Design System at HashiCorp Cradle Series by Will Wight Ember Community Survey A11y Automation GitHub Project Axe-core Follow Melanie: GitHub LinkedIn Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Joe Masilotti: Simplify Your Stack, Ship Mobile Sooner 55:42

8 weeks ago55:42

55:42

In this episode of Maintainable , Robby speaks with Joe Masilotti , an independent consultant who helps Rails teams ship mobile apps using Hotwire Native. Joe shares his perspective on what makes software maintainable—especially for consultants who need to onboard quickly. He explains why setup scripts often add unnecessary complexity, and how he evaluates a project’s maintainability by how quickly he can go from clone to coding. Robby and Joe also discuss how hybrid mobile development can offer faster delivery, fewer bugs, and better long-term flexibility—especially when teams reuse their existing Rails web views. Joe explains how Hotwire Native allows teams to incrementally introduce native features without rewriting their entire app. Whether you’re maintaining a mobile shell built two years ago or just starting to explore native development, Joe offers actionable advice on setting expectations, scoping client work, and navigating modern mobile tech stacks. ⏱️ Episode Highlights [00:01:17] Onboarding as a Measure of Maintainability Joe shares how quickly he can spin up a Rails app often reflects how maintainable it is. [00:05:12] Being a Good Guest in Someone Else’s Codebase Joe outlines his ideal onboarding checklist and how he adapts to unfamiliar environments. [00:08:00] Setting Communication and Collaboration Expectations The three questions Joe asks every client to understand how their team works. [00:13:02] Offering Opinions—Only Where Invited Why Joe stays scoped to the work he’s hired for, even when tempted to fix more. [00:14:15] When Technical Debt Enters the Conversation Joe explains how debt discussions usually emerge after version one is shipped. [00:15:33] Who Should Read Hotwire Native for Rails Developers Joe describes the type of developer his book is written for and what it covers. [00:18:01] Choosing Native vs. Hybrid for Your Rails App A framework comparison based on your current frontend architecture. [00:20:00] Introducing the Hotwire Native Mindset Why logic belongs on the server and the client should stay thin. [00:21:00] Bridge Components: How Rails, iOS, and Android Connect Joe walks through how native and web technologies pass data between layers. [00:24:00] Why Even a Web View-Based App is Worth Shipping The practical benefits of discoverability, push notifications, and native APIs. [00:28:01] Replacing Unmaintainable Apps with Hotwire Native Joe describes how hybrid rewrites often reduce mobile code by 90%. [00:31:33] Letting Go of Feature Parity Why most clients end up cutting features they originally wanted to preserve. [00:32:18] Scoping and Estimating Project-Based Work How Joe uses repeatable patterns to price fixed-fee consulting engagements. [00:35:15] Using AI to Translate Between Tech Stacks Joe shares how he leverages LLMs to explore unfamiliar languages like Kotlin. [00:42:26] Long-Term Maintainability and When to Touch the Code Why some apps don’t need changes for years—and that’s okay. [00:43:43] Why Hybrid Apps Are Easier to Replace Joe explains why hybrid apps are often more disposable and less risky than monolithic web apps. 🔗 Resources Mentioned: Joe’s Book: Hotwire Native for Rails Developers Joe’s Newsletter Hotwire Native Mindset Article Please Unsubscribe, Thanks by Julio Vincent Gambuto Follow Joe on X (formerly Twitter) and visit masilotti.com to learn more. Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Freedom Dumlao: What 70 Java Services Taught Me About Focus 1:03:19

12 weeks ago1:03:19

1:03:19

Freedom Dumlao (CTO at Vestmark ) joins Robby to explore what it means to maintain software at scale—and why teams sometimes need to unlearn the hype. With two decades of experience supporting financial systems, Freedom shares how his team manages a Java monolith that oversees $1.6 trillion in assets. But what’s most surprising? His story of how a team working on 70+ microservices rebuilt their platform as a single Ruby on Rails monolith—and started shipping faster than ever before. Episode Highlights [00:02:00] Why Respecting Legacy Code Matters Freedom reflects on a lesson he learned at Amazon: "Respect what came before." He discusses the value of honoring the decisions of past developers—especially when their context is unknown. [00:05:00] How Tests Help (and Where They Don’t) Freedom discusses how tests can clarify system behavior but not always intent—especially when market logic or business-specific rules come into play. [00:07:00] The Value of Understudies in Engineering Freedom shares how his team intentionally pairs subject matter experts with understudies to reduce risk and transfer knowledge. [00:09:30] Rethinking Technical Debt He challenges the fear-based framing of technical debt, comparing it instead to a strategic mortgage. [00:17:00] From 70 Services to 1 Monolith At FlexCar, Freedom led an unconventional rewrite—consolidating 70 Java microservices into a single Rails app. The result? A dramatic increase in velocity and ownership. [00:25:00] Choosing Rails Over Phoenix, Laravel, and Django After evaluating multiple frameworks, Rails' cohesiveness, Hotwire, and quick developer ramp-up made it the clear winner—even converting skeptical team members. [00:31:00] How Rails Changed Team Dynamics By reducing dependency handoffs, the new Rails app enabled solo engineers to own complete features. The impact? Faster delivery and more engaged developers. [00:36:30] Why Rails Still Makes Sense at a 20-Year-Old Company Even with a large Java codebase, Vestmark uses Rails for rapid prototyping and new product development. [00:41:00] Using AI to Navigate Legacy Systems Freedom explains how his team uses retrieval-augmented generation (RAG) to surface relevant code—but also the limitations of AI on older or less common codebases. [00:51:00] Seek Feedback, Not Consensus Freedom explains why aiming for alignment slows teams down—and how decision-makers can be inclusive without waiting for full agreement. Links and Resources Freedom Dumlao on LinkedIn Vestmark No Rules Rules Dungeon Crawler Carl series Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Mercedes Bernard: Friendly Code Welcomes Everyone In 49:27

14 weeks ago49:27

49:27

Mercedes Bernard , Staff Software Engineer at Kit , joins Robby to talk about what it really means to write code that lasts—and who it should be written for. In this episode of Maintainable , Mercedes shares a thoughtful and practical perspective on working with legacy codebases, managing technical debt, and creating a team culture that values maintainability without fear or shame. Her guiding principle? Well-maintained software is friendly software—code that is understandable and approachable, especially for early-career developers. Together, they discuss how to audit and stabilize older systems, avoid full rewrites, and create consistent developer experiences in large applications. Mercedes reflects on her decade in consulting and how that shaped her approach to navigating incomplete documentation, missing historical context, and multiple competing patterns in a codebase. She breaks down different types of technical debt, explains why not all of it is inherently bad, and offers strategies for advocating for maintenance work across engineering and product teams. The conversation also touches on architecture patterns like job fan-out, measuring performance regressions, reducing infrastructure load, and building momentum for improvements even when leadership isn’t actively prioritizing them. If you’ve ever felt overwhelmed by a messy project or struggled to justify maintenance work, this episode will leave you with a fresh mindset—and a few practical tactics—for making code more sustainable and inclusive. Episode Highlights [00:01:08] Defining Well-Maintained Software Mercedes explains her top metric: software that feels friendly , especially to early-career developers navigating the codebase for the first time. [00:03:00] What Friendly Code Actually Looks Like She shares why consistency, discoverability, and light documentation (like class comments or UML snippets) can make a huge difference. [00:05:00] Assessing Code Like a House Tour Mercedes introduces her metaphor of giving a house tour to evaluate code: does everything feel like it’s in the right place—or is the stove in the cabinet? [00:06:53] Consulting Mindset: Being a Guest in the Codebase With a decade of consulting experience, Mercedes shares how she navigates legacy systems when historical context is long gone. [00:10:40] Stabilizing a Startup’s Tangled Architecture She walks through an in-depth case study where she helped a client with multiple abandoned services get back to stability—without a rewrite. [00:17:00] The Power of a One-Line Fix Mercedes shares how a missing check caused a job to fan out 30 million no-op background jobs a day—and how one line of code reduced that by 75%. [00:23:40] Why State Checks Belong Everywhere She explains how defense-in-depth patterns help avoid job queue flooding and protect system resources early in the fan-out process. [00:24:59] Reframing Technical Debt Not all debt is bad. Mercedes outlines three types—intentional, evolutionary, and time-based—and how to approach each one differently. [00:28:00] Why Teams Fall Behind Without Realizing It Mercedes and Robby talk about communication gaps between engineers and product stakeholders—and why it’s not always clear when tech debt starts piling up. [00:34:00] Quantifying Developer Friction Mercedes recommends expressing technical debt in terms of lost time, slow features, and increased cost rather than vague frustrations. [00:42:00] Getting Momentum Without Permission Her advice to individual contributors: start small. Break down your frustrations into bite-sized RFCs or tickets and show the impact. [00:45:40] Letting the Team Drive Standards Mercedes encourages team-led conventions over top-down declarations, and explains why having any decision is better than indecision. [00:47:54] Recommended Reading She shares a surprising favorite: The Secret Life of Groceries , a systems-thinking deep dive into the grocery industry by Benjamin Lorr . Resources & Links 🧠 Mercedes Bernard’s website 🛠 Kit 📘 The Secret Life of Groceries by Benjamin Lorr 🔎 Fan-out Pattern – Martin Fowler (for deeper context on fan-out job strategies) 💬 Mercedes on LinkedIn Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Evan Phoenix: The Why of the One Line 1:09:13

15 weeks ago1:09:13

1:09:13

Evan Phoenix ( @evanphx ), CEO of Miren , joins Robby to explore the subtle but powerful difference between writing code that works and writing code that explains itself . They discuss the role of clarity in maintainable systems, why splitting a monolith can backfire, and what developers can learn from artists and tradespeople alike. Episode Highlights [00:01:30] What Makes Software Maintainable? Evan defines maintainability as how easily a newcomer can make a change with minimal context. [00:02:30] Why Business Logic Should Be Obvious A discussion on domain knowledge leakage and abstracting rules like “can we sell today?” [00:05:00] Programming 'Mouthfeel' and the Trap of Prefactoring Evan explains why prematurely optimizing for reuse can lead to unnecessary complexity. [00:07:00] When to Extract Logic: The Copy/Paste Signal A practical approach to identifying reusable components by spotting repeated code. [00:08:00] Technical Debt as a Reflection of Cognitive Load Why forgetting your own code doesn’t automatically mean it’s “bad” code. [00:10:30] Testing as Emotional Insurance How writing even basic checks can build team confidence—especially when test coverage is weak. [00:13:00] Daily Integration Tests: A Low-Pressure Safety Net Using nightly integration runs to catch invisible bugs in complex systems. [00:14:00] Confidence > 100% Test Coverage Why fast feedback loops matter more than aiming for exhaustive tests. [00:20:00] Splitting the Monolith: A Cautionary Tale Evan shares how decoupling apps without decoupling the database created chaos. [00:22:00] Shared Models, Split Repos, and Hidden Pitfalls The unexpected bugs that emerge when two apps maintain duplicate models and validations. [00:23:00] Better Alternatives to Splitting Codebases How separate deployments and tooling can mimic team separation without architectural debt. [00:28:00] The Hidden Cost of Diverging Business Domains When apps evolve independently, business logic begins to drift—undermining consistency. [00:29:00] Building Miren and Staying Motivated How Evan approaches early-stage product development with curiosity and detachment. [00:36:00] How to Know When Your Open Source Project Is “Done” Reframing “dead” projects as complete—and why stability is often a feature. [01:01:00] Signals for Trusting Open Source Dependencies Evan’s mental checklist for evaluating if a library is worth adopting. [01:07:00] The Importance of Hiring Junior Developers Why investing in beginners is crucial for the future of our industry. [01:08:00] Book Recommendations Evan recommends The Inner Game of Tennis and Snow Crash . Links and Resources Evan Phoenix’s Website Evan on GitHub Evan on Mastodon Book Recommendations The Inner Game of Tennis (book) Snow Crash by Neal Stephenson Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Chris Salvato: Building Developer Paradise by Sitting in the Problem Space 46:31

16 weeks ago46:31

46:31

Software isn’t always about rapid iteration. Sometimes, the real challenge lies in carefully assessing the existing environment. Chris Salvato , a Senior Staff Engineer at Shopify , believes that spending time in the “problem space” is vital for any long-lived application. Rather than diving immediately into controllers and tests, he begins by talking to everyone who interacts with the code—engineers, product owners, even directors who oversee strategy. This approach reveals hidden friction points that rarely come to light in larger, more formal meetings. When code grows organically over years, a range of issues emerges. Small workarounds might accumulate, new features can overlap with older ones, and domain boundaries become murky. Chris suggests mapping these overlaps through in-depth conversations so the team can pinpoint what genuinely obstructs productivity. He emphasizes that many developers may focus on surface fixes—updating a library here, renaming a class there—without acknowledging underlying confusion in the domain model itself. Removing extraneous code, clarifying domain entities, and aligning the team’s understanding can drastically reduce missteps. An interesting aspect of Chris’s method is his view of “developer paradise.” A codebase reaches this state when new contributors can navigate it with minimal help. Instead of sifting through endless documentation or complex wikis, they can figure out how classes, modules, and services connect simply by reading the code. Chris notes that achieving this often involves pruning unnecessary files or responsibilities. The end result is software that “self-documents,” easing onboarding and reducing reliance on external explanations. The conversation also touches on how large language models (LLMs) fit into the puzzle. Many organizations see AI-driven coding assistants as a way to accelerate development. Chris agrees they have potential, yet highlights a critical requirement: the code must be well-organized. If the system is sprawling and inconsistent, these tools may only add confusion. Lean, carefully segmented projects let both people and AI more effectively track what’s happening under the hood. Reducing code bloat leads naturally to discussions about prioritizing. Chris encourages teams not to tackle every annoyance at once. He references the importance of framing a unifying question, such as “Which feature or aspect of the app causes the greatest confusion among team members?” Spending too little time on this question, he warns, results in half-hearted improvements that eventually revert back to chaos. By contrast, devoting a few dedicated sprints—guided by thoughtful one-on-one interviews—can create lasting changes that set the entire codebase on a better trajectory. One intriguing theme is how personal growth ties into organizational impact. Chris acknowledges that developers often switch companies every few years, which might discourage them from investing deeply in a legacy codebase they won’t maintain long-term. Yet taking the lead in clarifying domain logic or reorganizing outdated sections is a skill-building opportunity. Future employers also notice engineers who can transform messy architectures into clear, future-friendly systems. In that sense, there’s a mutual benefit: the company gains maintainable software, while the developer acquires project leadership experience. The idea of “sitting in the problem space” resonates throughout Chris’s remarks. He encourages engineers to resist the reflex to propose solutions too early. Instead, they should keep asking why a particular annoyance or bug persists. Is it a symptom of a misaligned feature set, or is it rooted in limited domain knowledge among contributors? By reframing those frustrations as questions about responsibilities, the team often discovers simpler fixes than a heavy-handed rewrite. Conversely, where deeper rewrites are indeed warranted, Chris believes it’s best for the team to see that direction as unanimous rather than dictated from the top. Long-standing software also carries emotional baggage. People might have strong feelings about how something “ought” to be done, or they may have encountered recurring hurdles. Chris advocates using one-on-one conversations to let these concerns surface naturally, free from the pressure of group settings where quieter voices might hold back. Once everyone’s perspective is heard, common threads become clearer, enabling the team to converge on a smaller list of genuinely important tasks. When the group reconvenes, the sense of shared purpose helps unify efforts in a way that scattered brainstorming rarely achieves. The conversation also highlights resourceful domain modeling, which draws some inspiration from the microservices world but doesn’t necessarily require the code to be broken up into tiny services. Instead, Chris suggests that well-defined boundaries within a monolith can deliver comparable clarity—if the team respects those boundaries. He points to examples like Stripe or reading materials on Domain-Driven Design to show how cohesive object structures can help avoid big architectural hurdles. His closing thoughts revolve around long-term sustainability. Even if an engineer isn’t planning to remain on a project indefinitely, they can leave a meaningful legacy by clarifying crucial parts of the code, championing simpler naming conventions, and encouraging more open dialogue among team members. The impact, Chris notes, goes beyond the immediate project: every person who touches that code later benefits from these improvements, often for years to come. Time-Stamped Highlights [00:00:00] Welcome and Well-Maintained Software: Robby opens by asking Chris about foundational traits of dependable, long-lasting codebases. [00:00:58] Defining “Well Maintained”: They explore how clear conventions and minimal bloat not only reduce confusion but also prolong the life of a system. [00:01:28] LLMs and Context Windows: Chris delves into why large codebases challenge AI-driven coding assistants—and how trim, well-modeled systems sidestep this pitfall. [00:02:00] Joining Shopify and Facing Legacy Systems: Chris recalls his early days at Shopify, realizing that older Rails apps demanded a more structured method of discovery. [00:03:08] Concept of “Developer Paradise”: He shares his perspective on how removing unneeded documentation and extraneous complexity makes daily development more enjoyable. [00:05:32] Framework for Tackling Old Code: Chris outlines his signature approach: booking numerous 1-on-1 meetings to gather honest feedback from stakeholders before touching the code. [00:07:15] Finding High-Leverage Problems: Robby and Chris discuss distilling this feedback into a shortlist of real bottlenecks that the team can tackle together. [00:15:00] From Problem Space to Solutions: They spotlight the value of framing a single unifying question—like “How do we reduce confusion?”—to keep everyone working toward the same outcome. [00:20:07] Balancing Personal Goals and Company Needs: Chris underlines how aligning individual ambitions with business objectives fosters commitment to sustained improvement. [00:32:00] Long-Term Value and Leadership: Closing out, Robby and Chris consider how short-tenure engineers can leave a lasting impact by helping a team focus on its biggest pain points. Resources & Mentions Shopify Ruby on Rails Chris’s GitHub Chris’s LinkedIn Chris’s Twitter/X The One Thing by Gary Keller Titan: The Life of John D. Rockefeller, Sr. by Ron Chernow Martin Fowler on Microservices Domain-Driven Design 🍇 Thanks to Our Sponsor! Jelly is the simplest, most affordable way to deal with your “contact@...” emails. Tired of sharing an email login, or CCing colleagues to loop them into conversations? Terrified by the dizzying total cost of big-name “customer support” tools? Jelly is the answer. Whether it's for customer support, community organizing, or even managing band emails, Jelly helps your team share an email inbox and manage your conversations in a simple, elegant way. Use the "I got this” feature to communicate responsibility and private comments for internal discussions. Jelly is perfect for small teams — because it was built by a small team. And Jelly is actually affordable — team-based pricing means everyone can pitch in with your team’s conversations with customers, clients, and beyond. Bonus for Maintainable listeners Get 20% off your first year at letsjelly.com/maintainable . Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Heimir Thor Sverrisson: Architecture First, Tech Debt Second 40:58

17 weeks ago40:58

40:58

Heimir Thor Sverrisson joins Robby to discuss the importance of software architecture in long-term maintainability. With over four decades in the industry, Heimir has witnessed firsthand how poor architectural decisions can set teams up for failure. He shares his experiences mentoring engineers, tackling technical debt, and solving large-scale performance problems—including one bank’s misguided attempt to fix system slowness by simply adding more CPUs. Heimir also discusses his work at MojoTech , the value of code reviews in consulting, and his volunteer efforts designing radiation-tolerant software for satellites. Episode Highlights [00:01:12] Why architecture is the foundation of maintainability – Heimir explains why starting with the wrong architecture dooms software projects. [00:02:20] Upfront design vs. agile methodologies – The tension between planning and iterative development. [00:03:33] When architecture becomes the problem – How business pivots can render initial designs obsolete. [00:05:06] The rising demand for rapid software delivery – Why modern projects have less time for deep architectural planning. [00:06:15] Defining technical debt in practical terms – How to clean up code without waiting for permission. [00:09:56] The rewrite that never launched – What happens when a company cancels a multi-million-dollar software project. [00:12:43] How a major bank tackled system slowness the wrong way – Adding CPUs didn’t solve their performance problems. [00:15:00] Performance tuning as an ongoing process – Why fixing one bottleneck only reveals the next. [00:22:34] How MojoTech mentors instead of manages – Heimir explains how their consultancy approaches team development. [00:27:54] Building software for space – How AMSAT develops radiation-resistant software for satellites. [00:32:52] Staying relevant after four decades in tech – The power of curiosity in a constantly changing industry. [00:34:26] How AI might (or might not) help maintainable software – Heimir shares his cautious optimism. [00:37:14] Non-technical book recommendation – The Man Who Broke Capitalism and its relevance to the tech industry. Resources & Links Heimir Thor Sverrisson on LinkedIn Heimir’s GitHub MojoTech AMSAT – Amateur Radio Satellite Organization Book Recmmendations The Man Who Broke Capitalism How to Make Things Faster 🍇 Thanks to Our Sponsor! Jelly is the simplest, most affordable way to deal with your “contact@...” emails. Tired of sharing an email login, or CCing colleagues to loop them into conversations? Terrified by the dizzying total cost of big-name “customer support” tools? Jelly is the answer. Whether it's for customer support, community organizing, or even managing band emails, Jelly helps your team share an email inbox and manage your conversations in a simple, elegant way. Use the "I got this” feature to communicate responsibility and private comments for internal discussions. Jelly is perfect for small teams — because it was built by a small team. And Jelly is actually affordable — team-based pricing means everyone can pitch in with your team’s conversations with customers, clients, and beyond. Bonus for Maintainable listeners Get 20% off your first year at letsjelly.com/maintainable . 💡 Enjoyed this episode? Share it with someone who cares about maintainable architecture and technical debt management ! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Noémi Ványi: Only Fix Problems That Are Actually Problems 42:01

18 weeks ago42:01

42:01

Not every messy piece of code needs a refactor. Noémi Ványi , Senior Software Engineer at Xata , joins Robby to discuss how to develop the intuition to know when refactoring is truly necessary and when it’s just unnecessary churn. She shares her approach to balancing pragmatism and maintainability, how product teams and developers can work better together, and why developer autonomy is key to sustainable software. Drawing from her experience working on both open-source and closed-source projects, Noémi reflects on the unique challenges each presents—whether it's dealing with unresponsive GitHub issue reporters, handling unanticipated user behaviors, or navigating large-scale refactors in existing systems. She also shares her philosophy on technical debt: not all of it needs to be paid down, and some of it can actually be strategic. Robby and Noémi also explore the importance of writing meaningful commit messages, the hidden benefits of reviewing open-source pull requests, and why developers should stop waiting for permission to clean up their codebases. Episode Highlights [00:01:00] The characteristics of well-maintained software: modular design, good tests, and observability. [00:02:00] Open source vs. closed source software: Why communication matters more than you think. [00:04:50] Not all technical debt is worth paying down— how to decide when to refactor. [00:06:20] Developing engineering intuition: How experience shapes decision-making. [00:11:08] Lessons from refactoring a log processing system at Elastic . [00:17:09] Strategies for modernizing legacy systems without unnecessary rewrites. [00:19:52] Why maintainability is a business requirement, not an afterthought. [00:24:03] Should developers ask for permission to clean up code or just do it? [00:27:00] The impact of good commit messages and pull request documentation ( GitHub PR Templates ). [00:30:00] Are issue templates in open source a helpful guardrail or a barrier? [00:32:00] How to gain autonomy as a developer and advocate for technical improvements. [00:39:00] Noémi’s advice: Only fix problems that are actually problems. Resources Mentioned Noémi Ványi’s Website Noémi Ványi on GitHub Elastic GitHub Pull Request Templates GitHub Book Recommendation Lost in Thought: The Hidden Pleasures of an Intellectual Life by Zena Hitz 🍇Thanks to Our Sponsor! Jelly is the simplest, most affordable way to deal with your “contact@...” emails. Tired of sharing an email login, or CCing colleagues to loop them into conversations? Terrified by the dizzying total cost of big-name “customer support” tools? Jelly is the answer. Whether it's for customer support, community organizing, or even managing band emails, Jelly helps your team share an email inbox and manage your conversations in a simple, elegant way. Use the "I got this” feature to communicate responsibility and private comments for internal discussions. Jelly is perfect for small teams — because it was built by a small team. And Jelly is actually affordable — team-based pricing means everyone can pitch in with your team’s conversations with customers, clients, and beyond. Bonus for Maintainable listeners Get 20% off your first year at letsjelly.com/maintainable . Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Julia López: Code Tells a Story—Even the White Spaces 50:32

20 weeks ago50:32

50:32

How much can legacy code tell us beyond just functionality? Julia López, Senior Software Engineer at Harvest , believes that even small details—such as white spaces, variable names, and formatting choices—can reveal a system’s history. In this episode, Julia and Robby discuss the importance of refactoring and how a strong engineering culture can make or break a team's ability to maintain and improve software over time. Julia shares her experience leading a multi-year overhaul of Harvest’s billing system, balancing stakeholder expectations while ensuring the rewrite delivered real value. They explore how refactoring decisions evolve as teams grow, how to mentor newer developers to feel empowered to make changes, and why Julia doesn’t always trust her own estimations (for good reason). She also opens up about the complexities of transitioning a live billing system while supporting customers, finance teams, and engineering operations—all without disrupting payments. Beyond technical decisions, they also dive into the challenges of communication in remote teams, the value of autonomy in software development, and how teams can make a case for technical debt reduction even when leadership isn’t prioritizing it. If you've ever struggled with refactoring legacy systems or advocating for improvements, this conversation is packed with practical lessons. 💡 Key Topics & Timestamps [00:00:22] Meet Julia López – Her background, role at Harvest, and passion for refactoring. [00:00:42] What Makes Software Maintainable? – A test suite you can trust and an engineering culture that values refactoring. [00:06:31] Leading Harvest’s Billing System Overhaul – Why a full rewrite made more sense than incremental improvements. [00:09:54] The Hidden Complexity of Billing Systems – Managing ACH, credit card, and invoice payments. [00:14:05] The Fear Factor in Large-Scale Refactoring – Why organizations hesitate and how to push forward. [00:18:47] Communication Challenges in Remote Teams – Why documentation and transparency matter beyond GitHub. [00:28:30] Finding and Enforcing Engineering Patterns – How teams can encourage consistency in a constantly evolving codebase. [00:35:45] Why Autonomy Matters for Developers – Learning through struggle and when to ask for help. [00:45:25] Advocating for Refactoring When Leadership Says No – Julia's approach: "Ask for forgiveness, not permission—but estimate higher." 🔗 Resources Mentioned Harvest – Julia's company Radical Candor by Kim Scott The Making of a Manager by Julie Zhuo Stripe – The payment processor used in Harvest’s billing system Git Blame – A tool for understanding code history 📢 Connect with Julia López Julia's Website LinkedIn GitHub BlueSky 🍇Thanks to Our Sponsor! Jelly is the simplest, most affordable way to deal with your “contact@...” emails. Tired of sharing an email login, or CCing colleagues to loop them into conversations? Terrified by the dizzying total cost of big-name “customer support” tools? Jelly is the answer. Whether it's for customer support, community organizing, or even managing band emails, Jelly helps your team share an email inbox and manage your conversations in a simple, elegant way. Use the "I got this” feature to communicate responsibility, and private comments for internal discussions. Jelly is perfect for small teams — because it was built by a small team. And, Jelly is actually affordable — team-based pricing means everyone can pitch in with your team’s conversations with customers, clients and beyond. Bonus for Maintainable listeners Get 20% off your first year at letsjelly.com/maintainable . Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Marty Haught: Rethinking Technical Debt—Is It Really Just Drift? 52:39

21 weeks ago52:39

52:39

Episode Overview Marty Haught joins Robby to discuss the sustainability of open-source projects , the challenges of maintaining RubyGems , and why the metaphor of technical debt may not fully capture how software ages. Instead, he suggests thinking of it as drift —the natural misalignment of software with its evolving purpose over time. They also dig into security challenges in package management, including how Ruby Central worked with Trail of Bits to audit RubyGems. Marty also shares insights on the EU Cyber Resilience Act and how it might affect open-source maintainers worldwide. Finally, they explore how companies can support open-source sustainability through corporate sponsorships and individual contributions. Topics Discussed [00:01:00] The two pillars of maintainable software: good tests and readability. [00:02:40] From Perl to Ruby: How readability changed Marty's approach to programming. [00:07:20] Is technical debt the right metaphor? Why "drift" might be a better fit. [00:11:00] What does it take to maintain RubyGems? Marty's role at Ruby Central . [00:14:00] Security in package management: How RubyGems handles vulnerabilities. [00:16:40] The role of external audits: Partnering with Trail of Bits for security improvements. [00:20:40] EU Cyber Resilience Act: How new regulations might affect open-source projects . [00:34:00] Funding open source: Why corporate sponsorships are becoming essential. [00:38:20] Processes in distributed teams: Balancing structure with flexibility. [00:44:45] Advocating for technical debt work in teams: How to make a compelling case. Key Takeaways Technical debt is often misunderstood. The real issue may not be shortcuts taken in the past, but the way software naturally drifts from its original purpose. Security in package management is a growing concern. Open-source ecosystems like RubyGems require continuous investment to remain secure. Open source needs sustainable funding. Relying on volunteers is not a long-term solution—companies need to contribute via corporate sponsorships . Advocating for code improvements requires strategy. Engineers should frame technical debt discussions around business impact, not just code quality. Resources Mentioned Marty Haught on LinkedIn Marty Haught on Twitter Ruby Central RubyGems Auditing the Ruby Ecosystem’s Central Package Repository – Trail of Bits EU Cyber Resilience Act Overview What the EU's New Software Legislation Means for Developers (GitHub Blog) Ruby Central Open Source Program – Get Involved Corporate Sponsors Program Give and Take by Adam Grant Connect with Marty LinkedIn Twitter BlueSky Thanks to Our Sponsor! Jelly is the simplest, most affordable way to deal with your “contact@...” emails. Tired of sharing an email login, or CCing colleagues to loop them into conversations? Terrified by the dizzying total cost of big-name “customer support” tools? Jelly is the answer. Whether it's for customer support, community organizing, or even managing band emails, Jelly helps your team share an email inbox and manage your conversations in a simple, elegant way. Use the "I got this” feature to communicate responsibility, and private comments for internal discussions. Jelly is perfect for small teams — because it was built by a small team. And, Jelly is actually affordable — team-based pricing means everyone can pitch in with your team’s conversations with customers, clients and beyond. Bonus for Maintainable listeners Get 20% off your first year at letsjelly.com/maintainable . Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Mike Bowers - From ISAM to JSON—Navigating 40+ Years of Database Evolution 44:46

22 weeks ago44:46

44:46

Mike Bowers, Chief Architect at FairCom , has spent decades navigating the evolution of database technology. In this conversation, he and Robby explore the challenges of maintaining a 40+ year-old codebase, balancing legacy constraints with forward-thinking design, and the realities of technical debt. Mike shares how FairCom transitioned from ISAM-based databases to modern JSON-driven APIs, the trade-offs between strict schemas and flexible document stores, and how software architecture plays a critical role in long-term maintainability. He also explains why human-readable JSON simplifies debugging, how documentation-driven development improves API usability, and why many software teams struggle with refactoring at the right time. Topics covered [00:05:32] The role of software architecture in long-term maintainability [00:10:45] Why FairCom's legacy ISAM technology still matters today [00:14:20] Transitioning to a JSON-based API for modern developers [00:19:40] The challenges of maintaining 40+ years of C code [00:24:10] Technical debt: What it really means and how to manage it [00:28:50] The trade-offs between strict schemas and flexible NoSQL approaches [00:34:00] When to refactor vs. when to start over from scratch [00:38:15] The influence of product management thinking on software architecture [00:42:30] Advice for engineers considering a shift into architecture roles Resources Mentioned FairCom Mike Bowers on LinkedIn FairCom on Twitter/X Book Recommendation: The Influential Product Manager by MSc Bucero Thanks to Our Sponsor! Need a smoother way to share your team's inbox? Jelly’s got you covered! 🍇✨ Jelly is perfect for small teams — because it was built by a small team. If you struggle with keeping your team’s knowledge organized and accessible, check out Jelly, a lightweight knowledge management tool designed to make finding answers easy—without all the clutter of traditional wikis. No more sticky situations or knowledge gaps—Jelly keeps everything smooth, and shareable. Bonus for Maintainable listeners Get 20% off your first year at letsjelly.com/maintainable, Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Lorna Mitchell: Writing Documentation Engineers Will Actually Read 43:18

24 weeks ago43:18

43:18

Join Robby as he chats with Lorna Mitchell , open source advocate and technical writer, about the art of creating documentation that doesn’t gather dust. Lorna shares her experiences as a maintainer of the open source project RST2PDF, the value of API governance, and how documentation bridges gaps in developer experience. Highlights: What Makes Software Maintainable: Characteristics like great documentation, automated tests, and onboarding ease. Documentation's Role in Long-Lived Software: Why it’s crucial for internal tools and open source projects alike. Open Source in Practice: Lorna’s journey with RST2PDF and adopting a tech stack she wasn’t initially fluent in. API Governance Simplified: Lorna explains the four levels of API readiness and how teams can work toward more usable APIs. Writing Documentation for Engineers: How style guides can empower contributors without overwhelming them. Using Tools to Improve Documentation: From linters to prose-checking tools like Veil, Lorna discusses practical tips. Key Takeaways: [00:01:00] What makes software well-maintained: documentation, accessibility, and automated tests. [00:03:10] Why documentation isn’t just for new users—Lorna’s experience with revisiting her own open source projects. [00:06:30] Diving into rst2pdf: Challenges in maintaining an abandoned project. [00:13:45] Balancing ownership and transitioning open source projects to new maintainers. [00:15:30] What is OpenAPI, and how does API governance impact usability? [00:26:10] The art of concise yet helpful documentation for different audiences. [00:33:00] Using examples in APIs to enhance clarity and reduce confusion. [00:40:00] Tools for improving writing, from prose linters to markdown syntax checkers. Resources Mentioned: Lorna Mitchell’s Website rst2pdf Project Simon Willison’s Post on One-Person Projects How to Take Smart Notes OpenAPI Specification Veil Prose Linter Follow Lorna: GitHub IndieWeb Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Carola Lilienthal: Tackling Technical Debt with Patterns and Domain Knowledge 43:00

25 weeks ago43:00

43:00

Episode Summary In this episode of Maintainable, Robby sits down with Carola Lilienthal , Software Architect and Managing Director at WPS . Together, they explore the intersection of cognitive science and software architecture, strategies for tackling technical debt, and why simplicity, modularity, and domain knowledge are crucial for maintainability. Carola shares her approach to improving legacy systems, fostering domain-driven development, and introducing sustainable patterns into software design. She also discusses the Modularity Maturity Index (MMI), a tool her team has used to assess and improve over 300 systems. Topics Covered [00:00:43] What makes software maintainable? [00:01:24] The importance of clear structure, modularity, and simplicity in software. [00:02:38] How patterns help reduce complexity and onboard developers faster. [00:04:42] Addressing the challenges of systems with mixed architectural patterns. [00:06:20] Strategies for fostering creativity while maintaining simplicity. [00:07:05] How to guide teams to balance technical experimentation and maintainability. [00:14:03] Practical techniques for documenting architecture and decisions. [00:16:17] What is the Modularity Maturity Index (MMI), and how does it measure system health? [00:18:02] Common mistakes in managing technical debt and how to avoid them. [00:21:20] Why domain knowledge is essential for innovation and problem-solving. [00:33:03] Evolving legacy systems with domain-driven design and transformation. Key Takeaways Modularity matters : Simplified, modular systems with high cohesion and loose coupling reduce cognitive load and technical debt. Patterns as a shared language : Establishing a pattern language within your team creates consistency and eases onboarding. Cognitive science in software : Architecture aligned with how our brains process complexity results in more maintainable systems. Domain knowledge drives innovation : Teams should focus their creativity on solving domain-specific problems, not over-complicating the architecture. The value of architecture documentation : Keeping clear decision records helps teams navigate legacy code and onboard new developers. Resources Mentioned Carola’s LinkedIn WPS Website Carola’s books: Sustainable Software Architecture Domain-Driven Transformation (English version coming soon) Modularity Maturity Index Overview Books Carola recommends: Reinventing Organizations by Frédéric Laloux Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton and Manuel Pais Be sure to follow Carola on LinkedIn and X . Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Joel Hawksley: The Hidden Costs of Frontend Complexity 46:13

26 weeks ago46:13

46:13

Topics Discussed The importance of changeability as a core characteristic of well-maintained software. How GitHub has approached accessibility as a business and legal imperative. The evolution of GitHub’s frontend system, spanning over 2,000 pages, and the concept of "frontend vintages." Primer: GitHub’s design system and the paradox of its success—consistency vs. changeability. The disproportionate maintenance costs of frontend systems compared to backend systems. Using tools like Axe and keyboard-only tests to identify and resolve accessibility issues. The philosophical balance between creativity and usability in software design. Practical advice for teams starting their accessibility journey with limited resources. How frontend complexity affects scalability, especially in app-like experiences. Joel’s advocacy for adopting off-the-shelf components to reduce complexity for smaller teams. Key Takeaways [00:01:12] What Defines Well-Maintained Software? Joel explains how changeability —the confidence to make and deploy changes—provides the foundation for high-quality software. [00:03:05] Accessibility as a Priority The Microsoft acquisition drove GitHub’s investment in accessibility, introducing SLAs, automated tools, and manual processes to track progress. [00:08:49] Primer: GitHub’s Design System Primer fosters consistency but introduces the challenge of making changes across a vast, interconnected system. [00:12:54] The Cost of Frontend Complexity Joel shares how browser quirks, device diversity, and other variables make frontend maintenance far more expensive than backend systems. [00:28:05] Where to Start with Accessibility Joel recommends focusing on key user workflows like signing up, making payments, and completing core tasks. He emphasizes the importance of tools like Axe and keyboard-driven tests. Notable Time-Stamps [00:01:12] What Makes Software Well-Maintained? Joel shares how changeability drives quality. [00:03:05] GitHub’s Accessibility Journey: The role of SLAs, audits, and automation. [00:08:49] Primer and Design Systems: Balancing consistency with innovation. [00:12:54] The Hidden Costs of Frontend Complexity: Lessons learned at GitHub. [00:20:33] Balancing Creativity with Usability: Joel reflects on the intersection of design and functionality. [00:28:05] Accessibility Best Practices: Where teams should focus their initial efforts. Resources Joel Hawksley’s Website Primer Design System Axe Accessibility Tools GitHub’s ViewComponent Framework Book Recommendation: How Buildings Learn by Stewart Brand Guest's Links Joel Hawksley on GitHub Joel Hawksley’s Website Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Austin Story: Making Software Easier to Change, Remove, and Evolve 47:08

31 weeks ago47:08

47:08

Austin Story, Senior Engineering Director at Doximity, joins Robby to explore the intricacies of building maintainable systems, fostering team accountability, and enabling faster iteration without sacrificing quality. Austin shares how his team approached migrating from a monolithic GraphQL architecture to a federated model, why simplicity matters for long-term success, and how guiding principles like YAGNI influence his decision-making. Doximity is a leading digital platform for medical professionals, and their technology blog offers deep dives into the systems and tools that power their innovative solutions. Key Topics Discussed [00:00:41] What is maintainable software? Austin highlights key traits, including testability, simplicity, and ease of removal. [00:02:09] Designing for removability: Why it's important and how it enables iterative progress. [00:03:05] YAGNI (You Aren’t Gonna Need It): How this principle shapes Austin's approach to feature development. [00:04:13] Migrating to GraphQL Federation: Benefits of breaking up a monolithic GraphQL server and the challenges faced during the transition. [00:05:56] GraphQL vs. REST: How GraphQL aids developer productivity while maintaining backward compatibility. [00:10:53] Collaboration between data and application teams: Using tools like Kafka to bridge gaps and improve workflow. [00:17:00] Upgrading Ruby on Rails applications: Balancing autonomy with central guidance for seamless updates. [00:27:55] Fostering ownership on teams: The cultural practices that empower engineers to take initiative and drive results. [00:34:29] Prioritizing work effectively: How Austin's team uses quarterly planning and measurable "goalposts" to align efforts with impact. [00:40:00] Avoiding bike-shedding: Keeping meetings and reviews focused on meaningful progress. Key Takeaways Simplicity Wins: Maintainable software is easier to adapt, remove, and iterate on when it's kept simple. Iterate and Refine: Use principles like YAGNI to avoid over-engineering and ensure systems are built to evolve. Collaboration Drives Success: Bridging communication between specialized teams can unlock untapped potential. Focus on Outcomes: Define clear goals and track measurable results to ensure projects align with business needs. Resources Mentioned YAGNI (You Aren’t Gonna Need It) GraphQL Federation Overview Doximity Technology Blog The Mom Test by Rob Fitzpatrick Austin Story on LinkedIn Austin Story's Website Stay Connected Follow Austin: LinkedIn Website Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Dan Moore: Building Developer-Friendly Authentication Solutions 49:20

32 weeks ago49:20

49:20

Topics Covered Characteristics of Maintainable Software Dan emphasizes the importance of internal consistency in codebases, automated tests, and proper documentation to preserve decision-making context. [00:05:32] Internal consistency: Why it matters. [00:08:09] Lessons from maintaining legacy codebases. Working with Legacy Systems Dan shares stories of upgrading ORM frameworks, introducing caching systems, and transitioning to bug tracking tools. [00:09:52] Replacing custom ORM systems with Hibernate and Ehcache. [00:13:10] Tackling high-risk components with automated testing. Modern Authentication Challenges As part of FusionAuth, Dan discusses building developer-friendly tools that balance local flexibility with SaaS convenience. [00:21:05] FusionAuth’s role in secure authentication. [00:28:13] Testing authentication flows locally and in CI pipelines. Navigating Constraints in Teams Advice for managing technical debt, advocating for team priorities, and communicating with stakeholders during lean times. [00:16:39] Communicating the impact of resource constraints. [00:19:27] Tracing single requests to understand complex systems. Industry Trends and AI's Role From managed services to the impact of AI on coding languages, Dan reflects on how the industry continues to evolve. [00:35:05] Managed services as accelerators for maintainability. [00:41:25] The potential and limits of AI in software development. Key Takeaways Consistency and documentation in codebases reduce cognitive overhead for developers. Understand how your software fits into the business to prioritize effectively. AI might reshape the industry, but it won’t replace the need for thoughtful problem-solving. Opinionated frameworks like Ruby on Rails continue to offer exceptional developer ergonomics. Resources Mentioned FusionAuth Blog Dan's Personal Blog CIAM Weekly Newsletter Dan’s Book: Letters to a New Developer Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance The Asimov story mentioned Try FusionAuth Download FusionAuth : Get started with the self-hosted version today. Free Trial of FusionAuth : Experience the FusionAuth cloud for free! Connect with Dan LinkedIn BlueSky Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Tom Johnson: From Auto-Documentation to Better Collaboration 43:19

33 weeks ago43:19

43:19

In this episode of Maintainable, Robby speaks with Tom Johnson , Co-Founder and CEO of Multiplayer . Tom shares his perspectives on the evolving landscape of distributed systems, the challenges of maintaining legacy software, and how innovative tools are transforming the way teams collaborate. Topics Discussed Characteristics of well-maintained software, from system-level documentation to effective workflows. The importance of debugging tools tailored for distributed systems. Anecdotes about managing technical debt, including cutting off a CEO’s database access. How auto-documentation and design branches in Multiplayer streamline team collaboration. Practical strategies for tackling technical debt and fostering developer morale. Key Takeaways [00:01:16] Defining Well-Maintained Software : Tom explains why documentation, tests, and collaborative workflows are essential. [00:06:14] The Case for Locking Down Production : Lessons learned from a humorous but cautionary tale. [00:18:11] Debugging Distributed Systems : How Multiplayer’s tools simplify the debugging process. [00:25:00] Design Branches and Team Collaboration : Enhancing communication through shared documentation. [00:31:39] Prioritizing Technical Debt : Identifying customer and developer pain points. Resources Mentioned Multiplayer Tom Johnson on LinkedIn Tom Johnson on Twitter Book Recommendation: Making Comics by Scott McCloud Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Gulcin Yildirim Jelinek: Maintaining Postgres for Modern Workloads 38:18

34 weeks ago38:18

38:18

In this episode of Maintainable , Robby speaks with Gulcin Yildirim Jelinek , a Staff Database Engineer at Xata . Joining from Prague, Czech Republic, Gulcin discusses her experiences working with legacy databases, the evolution of Postgres, and her passion for building accessible tech communities. Gulcin shares practical insights into modern database management, including the rise of automation tools like YAML and Pgroll, as well as how extensions like pgvector are unlocking new possibilities for Postgres users. Her work with the Prague PostgreSQL Meetup and Diva Conference highlights her dedication to fostering inclusive and welcoming tech communities. Episode Highlights [00:05:32] What Makes Databases Maintainable? Gulcin reflects on documentation, onboarding, and usability. [00:15:10] From Legacy to Modern: Challenges with legacy systems in hospitals and banks and the transition to Postgres. [00:22:18] Pgvector and Vector Search: Introducing Postgres extensions to enable vector-based queries. [00:28:12] Scaling Automation with YAML: How YAML transformed database management and DevOps workflows. [00:33:00] Fostering Community and Accessibility: Gulcin’s work with Postgres Europe and Diva Conference. [00:36:15] Mythology with a Twist: Book recommendations featuring Circe and Elektra . Key Takeaways Documentation Matters: A well-documented system ensures effective onboarding for both developers and end-users. Automation is Key: Tools like YAML and Pgroll streamline database operations, minimizing downtime and manual intervention. Inclusivity in Tech: Conferences and communities should prioritize accessibility, from catering to translation services. Vector Databases in Postgres: Pgvector is making Postgres a viable option for AI-driven workloads, eliminating the need for separate systems. Resources Mentioned Xata Blog Pgroll Prague PostgreSQL Meetup Diva: Dive into AI Conference Kadin Yazilimci (Women Developers of Turkey) Circe by Madeline Miller Elektra by Jennifer Saint Connect with Gulcin LinkedIn Prague PostgreSQL Meetup Diva Conference Book Recommendations: Circe Elektra Links: Kadin Yazilimci (Women Developers of Turkey) Diva: Dive into AI Conference Prague PostgreSQL Meetup On X Xata Blog Pgroll Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Justine Gehring: Refactoring Software at Scale with AI 48:07

35 weeks ago48:07

48:07

Robby sits down with Justine Gehring , an AI Research Engineer at Moderne , to explore how AI tools are transforming code maintenance and scalability. They dive into the unique ways AI can support refactoring for massive and legacy codebases, from retrieval-augmented generation (RAG) to lossless semantic trees, and discuss how developers can benefit from AI-assisted planning and refactoring. Justine shares her background transitioning from academia to industry and reflects on the essential role of reproducibility in AI, why maintainable code is often overlooked in research, and the challenges of balancing innovation with real-world reliability in software projects. Topics Discussed What Makes Software Maintainable : Justine’s take on good documentation, reusable code, and ensuring new team members can quickly navigate a codebase. [00:00:42] Academia vs. Industry in Code Maintainability : Why reproducibility and code maintenance often diverge in research settings, and how industry standards address this gap. [00:01:14] From Academia to AI Engineering : Justine shares her journey and how her background in machine learning led to a career in AI-focused software maintenance. [00:04:48] Scaling Refactoring with OpenRewrite : An introduction to OpenRewrite, the open-source tool that facilitates large-scale code transformations, developed by Moderne. [00:12:15] Lossless Semantic Trees : The benefits of LSTs for detailed code analysis, retaining essential syntax and type information critical for reliable AI refactoring. [00:20:24] Retrieval-Augmented Generation (RAG) : Justine explains RAG’s significance in allowing AI models to provide context-specific responses without heavy re-training. [00:26:00] Trust and Validation in AI-Generated Code : The importance of robust test cases and human oversight when leveraging AI-generated code to avoid cascading errors. [00:31:36] AI as a Planning Tool for Refactoring Projects : Justine’s insights on using AI as a collaborative coding assistant, offering developers suggestions for planning refactoring and maintenance tasks. [00:35:24] Real-World Example of Scaling Refactoring : Justine recounts a case study where Moderne used OpenRewrite to facilitate large-scale code migration involving multiple frameworks. [00:42:00] Advocating for AI Tools in Code Maintenance : Tips for developers interested in introducing AI tools and approaches within their teams or organizations. [00:42:31] Key Takeaways AI Supports Reproducibility and Reliability : Ensuring reproducibility in AI-driven tools can enhance both credibility and usability for complex codebases. Prioritize Planning Before Refactoring : Understanding code dependencies and structure is key to successful refactoring; AI tools like OpenRewrite can automate targeted changes. Human Expertise Remains Essential : AI can be an effective coding assistant, but human oversight is necessary to ensure accuracy and quality. Experiment and Scale : Start with small, impactful AI-assisted refactoring recipes and scale up once the process is reliable, saving significant development hours over time. Resources Moderne Justine Gehring’s LinkedIn OpenRewrite Documentation Getting to Yes by Roger Fisher and William Ury Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Katerina Skroumpelou: Bridging Engineering and Advocacy for Scalable Software 36:48

36 weeks ago36:48

36:48

As a product advocate at Nx , Katerina Skroumpelou combines her engineering skills with a knack for connecting with clients. In this episode, she shares how clear documentation, scalable architectures, and a collaborative culture can transform software development for the better. Key Takeaways [00:01:25] Katerina’s Background: Robby and Katerina discuss her career journey, starting in engineering and recently moving into product advocacy. [00:02:29] Characteristics of Well-Maintained Software: Katerina highlights key aspects of maintainable software—readability, scalability, and reliability. [00:04:39] Product Advocacy at Nx: Katerina describes her unique role, bridging technical support and customer outreach to ensure clients make the most of Nx tools. [00:07:01] White Glove Approach: The “white glove” service approach allows Katerina to dive deep into clients' codebases, offering a hands-on approach to using Nx effectively. [00:09:52] Scalable Documentation Practices: Balancing clarity and detail, Katerina provides tips on structuring code comments and READMEs to be concise yet thorough. [00:12:09] Managing Technical Debt: Robby and Katerina discuss the importance of keeping code up-to-date and scalable, especially in large systems with high demands. [00:16:00] The Importance of Collaboration: Moving from solo work to team-based code reviews taught Katerina the value of a collaborative approach to maintainable code. [00:19:15] Nx’s Monorepo Solution: How Nx provides cache and build tools to optimize mono-repo performance, boosting both speed and organization within projects. [00:22:12] Nx Cloud and CI: Katerina discusses Nx Cloud’s role in enhancing CI workflows by allowing parallel tasks and cache sharing across teams. [00:24:07] When to Consider Monorepos: Katerina explains the benefits of monorepos for organizing codebases and improving scalability. [00:26:37] AI Tools in Development: Katerina shares her enthusiasm for new AI tools like StackBlitz’s Bolt and their potential to streamline app development. [00:29:00] Finding Motivation at Work: Advice for developers who feel stuck or unmotivated in their current roles and ways to reconnect with the work they enjoy. Resources Mentioned Nx Dev StackBlitz Bolt.new Books: The Three-Body Problem by Cixin Liu Cryptonomicon by Neal Stephenson Slaughterhouse-Five by Kurt Vonnegut Katerina's social profiles: LinkedIn Twitter Bluesky Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Moriel Schottlender: The Challenges of Modernizing MediaWiki's Monolith 46:10

38 weeks ago46:10

46:10

Welcome to another engaging episode of the Maintainable Software Podcast! In this episode, Robby sits down with Moriel Schottlender, Principal Software Engineer at the Wikimedia Foundation , to explore the complex journey of modernizing MediaWiki , the software behind Wikipedia . Moriel shares her insights on what it takes to keep an enormous monolithic codebase maintainable while supporting an ever-growing and diverse set of global users. She highlights the importance of modularization, ownership, and the delicate balance between flexibility and stability in open-source software. Key Takeaways [00:00:51] Characteristics of Well-Maintained Software: Moriel discusses the three crucial characteristics of well-maintained software: ownership, modularization, and documentation. [00:01:09] Ownership and Rules for Contribution: Ownership goes beyond just fixing bugs—it involves understanding the architectural purpose and maintaining consistency even as teams change. [00:03:35] Product Vision's Role in Maintainability: Why a clear product vision is essential for maintaining software, even in the face of organic growth. [00:07:14] Balancing Experimentation and Long-Term Planning: Moriel shares insights into how Wikimedia balances rapid experimentation with careful, long-term architectural planning. [00:07:32] The Evolution of MediaWiki: MediaWiki's growth from a small project to the backbone of Wikipedia, now supporting over 900 wikis, and the challenges that come with scaling. [00:14:18] Modernizing a 23-Year-Old Monolith: Robby and Moriel dive into the challenges of modernizing MediaWiki’s architecture, including the difficulties of updating a monolithic structure. [00:17:15]Wikitext vs. Markdown: Moriel explains why MediaWiki uses its own Wikitext language instead of Markdown and the unique challenges it presents. [00:22:25] Architectural Flexibility for the Future: The importance of having a flexible architecture that can adapt to the evolving needs of users and technologies. [00:26:04] Technical Debt and Modularization: How Wikimedia approaches technical debt in MediaWiki and prioritizes architectural interventions to improve modularity and maintainability. [00:39:00] Community Contributions to MediaWiki: Strategies for increasing developer contributions and how Wikimedia empowers volunteers while maintaining software quality. [00:41:59] Advice for Aspiring Open Source Contributors: Moriel shares encouraging words for anyone looking to contribute to open-source projects, emphasizing that everyone can make a meaningful impact. [00:35:44] The Role of Documentation: Moriel discusses Wikimedia's efforts to improve documentation and ensure it's useful for both developers and end-users, leveraging the strengths of wiki-based contributions. [00:30:29] Celebrating Small Wins: Moriel talks about how Wikimedia celebrates small victories to keep team morale high in the face of big challenges. Resources Mentioned Moriel's Website Moriel on Mastodon MediaWiki Documentation Book Recommendation: Year Zero by Rob Reid Connect with Moriel Moriel on LinkedIn Instagram Twitter GitHub Mastodon Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Kate Holterhoff: From Front-End Engineering to Developer Advocacy 51:55

39 weeks ago51:55

51:55

Welcome to another engaging episode of Maintainable! Robby sits down with Kate Holterhoff, Ph.D., a Senior Analyst at RedMonk and former front-end engineer, to explore the intricate world of software maintenance, documentation, and the future of developer roles. Kate brings her unique perspective from her time as a practitioner at a digital marketing agency, her academic background, and her current role in developer advocacy. Topics Explored [00:00:00] Introduction to Kate's Background : Robby and Kate discuss her journey from academia to front-end engineering and now to being a Senior Analyst at RedMonk. Kate shares how her experiences have shaped her perspective on software maintenance. [00:04:00] Well-Maintained Software : Kate dives into her definition of well-maintained software, emphasizing modularity, semantic readability, and the importance of considering future developers who will interact with the code. [00:11:30] The Challenges of Agency Work : Kate reflects on her time at a digital marketing agency, where she often worked on projects that had passed through many hands. She discusses the importance of balancing quick deliverables with maintainability. [00:20:45] The Role of Documentation : Kate shares insights on the value of documentation for distributed teams, highlighting her experience organizing documentation sessions ("documentation paloozas") to capture team knowledge and ensure maintainability. [00:30:00] RedMonk and Developer Advocacy : Kate explains her role at RedMonk and how the firm differs from traditional analyst firms like Gartner. She discusses RedMonk's focus on developers as key decision-makers in the tech landscape. [00:39:15] Front-End Developers as Kingmakers : Robby and Kate explore how front-end engineers are increasingly influencing the adoption of tools and technologies within organizations. Kate describes this trend as front-end developers becoming "kingmakers" in the industry. [00:49:50] AI and Developer Tools : Kate discusses the integration of AI into developer tools, the potential benefits, and challenges for junior developers. She emphasizes the importance of understanding how to read code in an AI-assisted world. Key Takeaways: Emphasize modularity and semantic readability to ensure code can be easily maintained by future developers. Documentation is crucial for maintainability, especially in distributed and contractor-heavy teams. Front-end developers are becoming key decision-makers, influencing tool and technology adoption. AI is increasingly integrated into developer workflows, making it essential for developers to focus on reading and understanding code. The definition of a 'developer' is evolving, with more abstracted tools and AI playing a larger role in development processes. Resources Mentioned: RedMonk Kate Holterhoff on LinkedIn Kate Holterhoff on Twitter Darwin's The Origin of Species Episode Highlights: [00:00:00] Introduction to Kate's Background [00:04:00] Characteristics of Well-Maintained Software [00:20:45] The Importance of Documentation [00:30:00] What Does a Senior Analyst at RedMonk Do? [00:39:15] Front-End Developers as Kingmakers [00:49:50] The Role of AI in Developer Tools Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Alan Ridlehoover: Building Robust Systems Through Behavior-Centric Testing 48:27

40 weeks ago48:27

48:27

Alan Ridlehoover: Building Robust Systems Through Behavior-Centric Testing In this episode of Maintainable, Robby speaks with Alan Ridlehoover , Senior Engineering Manager at Cisco Meraki . Alan shares his perspective on building well-maintained software by focusing on behavior-centric testing, clear code ownership, and thoughtful technical decisions that stand the test of time. Alan discusses his experience working in both startup environments and large-scale engineering teams, including how he navigates the unique challenges of each. He provides practical advice on managing conditional logic in code, scaling with third-party dependencies, and ensuring that testing strategies remain effective as systems grow in complexity. Key Takeaways: The characteristics of well-maintained software: behavior-centric testing, solid code principles, and ownership boundaries. Balancing the needs of startups vs. large enterprises when it comes to software maintenance. Alan’s approach to handling conditional logic with a technique called "rehydration" to simplify complex code. Why focusing on behavior, not implementation, is critical for scalable, maintainable tests. The importance of interfaces and facades for managing third-party dependencies and future scalability. How to approach technical debt as a conscious trade-off, not an inevitable burden. Best practices for addressing flaky tests, including managing non-determinism, order dependencies, and race conditions. How to set up effective monitoring and alerting systems to maintain a healthy software environment. The role of team structure and product ownership in delivering sustainable, high-quality software. Episode Highlights: [00:05:32] Introduction to the Guest's Background: Robby and Alan discuss Alan's work at Cisco Meraki and his approach to well-maintained software. [00:15:10] The Importance of Behavior-Centric Testing: Alan explains why focusing on behavior, not implementation, helps in both startups and large-scale environments. [00:24:30] Rehydration: A Strategy for Managing Conditional Logic in Code: Alan shares his method for simplifying code with many conditionals. [00:35:00] Navigating Technical Debt: Alan offers advice on how to strategically manage technical debt without slowing down business needs. [00:45:18] Monitoring and Alerting: Alan’s tips on keeping systems healthy and avoiding customer-facing issues through smart monitoring setups. Resources Mentioned: Radical Candor by Kim Scott The Code Gardener Connect with Alan Ridlehoover: LinkedIn The Code Gardener Blog Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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April Wensel: Navigating Legacy Code with Compassion 52:05

41 weeks ago52:05

52:05

In this episode of Maintainable , Robby speaks with April Wensel , Founder and Owner of Compassionate Coding . April shares her journey in the software industry and how she came to embrace compassion as a core value in coding and team dynamics. She explains why empathy is critical when working with legacy code, mentoring junior developers, and addressing technical debt. Episode Highlights [00:05:32] Introduction to Compassionate Coding: April discusses the mission behind Compassionate Coding and why human-centered development is essential. [00:13:36] Compassion and Technical Debt: How fostering a compassionate mindset helps teams navigate the challenges of maintaining legacy code and tackling technical debt. [00:20:10] Empathy in Code Reviews: April talks about the role of compassion in creating healthy, constructive code review cultures. [00:26:30] Onboarding with Compassion: The importance of pairing and empathy in onboarding new engineers, whether junior or senior. [00:31:55] The Refactor vs. Rewrite Debate: April explains why she usually sides with refactoring over rewriting code, and how compassion can inform that decision. [00:41:20] The Role of Leadership in Code Quality: How leaders can set the tone for compassionate coding by prioritizing better documentation and creating a supportive team environment. [00:44:56] Community Service and Building Empathy: April shares how volunteering outside of tech has helped her develop empathy that translates into better teamwork and communication in the workplace. Key Takeaways: Compassion in coding isn’t just about clean code; it's about how we treat ourselves and others in the process of writing and maintaining software. Legacy code doesn’t have to be a source of frustration; by embracing empathy and self-compassion, teams can tackle it with a positive mindset. Pairing and mentorship are powerful tools in onboarding, helping to bring new team members into a supportive, inclusive environment. Effective communication with stakeholders about technical debt requires empathy and understanding of their priorities. Compassionate coding also extends beyond the development team, influencing interactions with non-engineers, users, and the broader community. Resources: Compassionate Coding April's Twitter 12 Steps to a Compassionate Life by Karen Armstrong Follow April Wensel: LinkedIn Twitter Website Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Saron Yitbarek: The Balance Between Maintainable Code and Multiple Streams of Income 41:20

42 weeks ago41:20

41:20

In this episode of the Maintainable Software Podcast, Robby sits down with Saron Yitbarek , founder and CEO of DiscoLink , to explore the challenges of maintaining early-stage software while balancing multiple streams of income. Saron shares her journey from being a solo developer to hiring her first teammate and the lessons learned along the way about code maintainability and business logic. Episode Highlights [00:05:32] Introduction to Saron's Background: Robby and Saron discuss her startup, DiscoLink, and the initial development of its MVP. [00:10:50] The Importance of Context in Code: Saron emphasizes why understanding the business decisions behind code is crucial for maintainability. [00:15:10] Onboarding a New Developer: Saron shares her experience hiring her first developer and how it changed her approach to software maintenance. [00:20:32] Multiple Streams of Income: Saron explains her motivation behind building DiscoLink to help professionals manage different revenue streams. [00:25:40] Transparency Around Money: A candid conversation about developers’ fears around charging for their work and how to overcome them. [00:30:45] Ethics and Side Projects: Robby and Saron discuss ethical considerations when working on side projects while employed full-time. [00:35:12] How Podcasting Shaped Saron's Career: Saron talks about how being a podcast host impacted her career growth and networking. Key Takeaways Maintainability Beyond Code: Saron highlights the importance of documenting not just the code but also the business rationale behind decisions. Onboarding Challenges: Bringing a new developer into a solo-built project requires strong communication, context sharing, and flexible documentation practices. The Power of Multiple Income Streams: Saron’s vision with DiscoLink focuses on helping tech professionals build financial security through various revenue channels. Confronting Money Anxiety: Many developers struggle with charging for their work, but transparency and community conversations help break down those barriers. Ethical Side Projects: It's important to consider the ethical implications of using work-learned skills for personal projects. Resources Saron Yitbarek on LinkedIn Saron Yitbarek on Twitter DiscoLink Website Book Recommendation: Formerly Known as Food by Kristin Lawless Links: My newsletter: https://themultihyphenate.ck.page/newsletter Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Lutz Hühnken: Crafting Resilient Systems with Event-Driven Design 44:45

44 weeks ago44:45

44:45

Introduction In this episode of Maintainable, Robby speaks with Lutz Hühnken , Head of Engineering Excellence at Upvest , about the transformative power of event-driven architecture in software development. Lutz brings his extensive experience to the table, discussing how breaking down complex systems into manageable modules and leveraging event-driven design can lead to more resilient and maintainable software. Topics Discussed [00:05:32] Introduction to Well-Maintained Software : Lutz shares his thoughts on the key characteristics of maintainable software, emphasizing modularity and simplicity. [00:10:24] Challenges with "Magic" in Code : The pitfalls of relying too much on frameworks and ORMs, including examples from Lutz’s experience with Hibernate. [00:11:16] Understanding Event-Driven Architecture : Lutz explains the fundamentals of event-driven architecture and its advantages over traditional command-driven approaches. [00:13:50] The Role of Promises in Event-Driven Systems : How clear design-time responsibilities ensure reliability in event-driven communication. [00:15:43] Choreography vs. Orchestration : The debate between these two approaches to managing workflows and why Lutz favors choreography for most systems. [00:17:57] Onboarding Developers in Event-Driven Systems : Tips for effectively integrating new team members into an event-driven architecture. [00:26:52] The Role of Engineering Excellence at Upvest : Lutz discusses his new role and the importance of systems thinking in guiding architectural decisions. [00:34:55] Managing Technical Debt : Lutz offers insights into balancing feature development with addressing technical debt, emphasizing the importance of a healthy investment distribution. Key Takeaways Breaking down large systems into smaller modules with clear boundaries can significantly enhance maintainability. Event-driven architecture offers a powerful way to decouple system components, making them more resilient and scalable. Developers should be cautious of "magic" in code, such as heavy reliance on ORMs, which can obscure underlying complexities and hinder maintainability. Choreography often provides a more scalable and maintainable approach than orchestration in managing complex workflows. Technical debt should be managed proactively, with regular investments in refactoring and productivity enhancements to maintain long-term software health. Resources Mentioned Lutz Hühnken's Blog Event-Driven Architecture by Martin Fowler The Open Society and Its Enemies by Karl Popper Event-Driven Architecture Reading List Connect with Lutz Hühnken LinkedIn Mastodon Bluesky Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Noel Rappin: Reviving the Pickaxe— A Journey through Ruby's Legacy 43:58

45 weeks ago43:58

43:58

In this episode of the Maintainable Software Podcast, Robby is joined by Noel Rappin , Staff Engineer at Chime Financial , and the mind behind the latest edition of the classic Programming Ruby book, affectionately known as the "Pickaxe." Noel delves into the intricate process of modernizing a legacy technical book and the lessons learned along the way. Episode Highlights [00:05:32] A Legacy Revisited : Noel Rappin reflects on the process of updating the Programming Ruby book, navigating the balance between preserving its legacy and making it relevant for today’s Ruby community. [00:10:17] The Challenges of Modernizing : Noel discusses the complexities of working on a legacy book, including maintaining a consistent tone, updating technical content, and making strategic decisions about what to include or omit. [00:16:12] Parallels with Legacy Code : Noel shares his insights on the similarities between updating a legacy book and maintaining legacy software, emphasizing the importance of understanding past decisions before making changes. [00:21:00] Curating Ruby's Evolution : How Noel approached the task of deciding which Ruby features and practices to highlight in the new edition, considering the evolution of the Ruby community since the book's last update. [00:27:00] The Ruby Ecosystem as a Legacy System : Exploring the idea that the entire Ruby ecosystem can be seen as a legacy system, shaped by past decisions and community standards. [00:33:47] Advice for Aspiring Technical Authors : Noel offers practical tips for those interested in contributing to or updating legacy technical books, including how to pitch ideas to publishers and navigate the challenges of working on established projects. [00:40:00] Maintaining Relevance : Strategies for keeping both software and technical books up-to-date, including Noel's thoughts on the importance of documentation and regular updates. Key Takeaways Updating a legacy technical book requires a deep understanding of the community's current needs and the ability to balance respect for the original work with the necessity of modern relevance. The process of modernizing a book like Programming Ruby shares many similarities with maintaining legacy software, including the importance of understanding past decisions and the challenges of working with outdated practices. Community standards play a crucial role in both software maintenance and technical writing, guiding the evolution of both fields. Noel emphasizes the importance of documentation in legacy projects, whether in software or publishing, as a tool for preserving context and aiding future contributors. Resources Mentioned Programming Ruby 3.3 (5th Edition) - The latest "Pickaxe" book, authored by Noel Rappin. Use promo code maintainablefm2024 to get 35% off the ebook. Chime Financial Murderbot Diaries by Martha Wells Wayfarers series by Becky Chambers Rubular - Ruby Regular Expression Editor Noel Rappin's Website Noel Rappin on LinkedIn Noel Rappin on Twitter For more episodes like this, be sure to subscribe to the Maintainable Software Podcast . Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Cassidy Williams: Navigating the Career Jungle Gym in Tech 43:18

46 weeks ago43:18

43:18

In this episode of the Maintainable Software Podcast, Robby sits down with Cassidy Williams , Developer Advocate at GitHub, to explore the dynamic nature of a tech career, the delicate balance between clever code and maintainability, and the evolving trends in software development. Cassidy begins by discussing what makes software truly maintainable—starting with the ease of onboarding for new developers. She emphasizes the importance of clear documentation and warns against the pitfalls of writing overly clever code that might be difficult to maintain in the future. They then delve into the challenges of joining an existing codebase and managing technical debt. Cassidy shares her experiences, noting how codebases often start pristine but become more cumbersome as projects evolve and pivot. The Importance of Onboarding: Cassidy explains how fast someone can jump in and start working on code as a key indicator of well-maintained software. [00:10:21] Balancing Cleverness and Maintainability: Cassidy elaborates on why writing clever code can be a double-edged sword when it comes to long-term maintainability. [00:16:00] Navigating Career Pivots: Cassidy reflects on her own career journey, likening it to a "career jungle gym" where paths are non-linear and require thoughtful decision-making. [00:18:36] Working at Netlify: Cassidy shares her experience with upgrading a router within an existing codebase, highlighting the importance of collaboration and bringing in external expertise. [00:24:00] Local-First Software: Robby and Cassidy explore the trend of local-first software, emphasizing the benefits of data ownership and the ability to work offline. [00:26:30] Developer Wishlists: Cassidy suggests creating personal and communal wishlists for addressing technical debt, fostering a collaborative approach to maintaining software. [00:31:50] Jumblie - Cassidy's Side Project: Cassidy introduces her word game, Jumblie , detailing its development process and the unique challenges she faced. Cassidy also discusses her love for Brandon Sanderson's books, specifically the Mistborn trilogy, and the importance of owning your data in today’s digital landscape. Key Takeaways: Maintainable software allows new developers to quickly contribute, thanks to clear documentation and readable code. Clever code can be a joy to write but may lead to maintenance challenges down the line. A career in tech often resembles a jungle gym, requiring flexibility and thoughtful navigation. Involving open-source maintainers in large codebase changes can provide invaluable insights and streamline the process. Local-first software is gaining traction, offering benefits in data ownership and offline functionality. Resources Mentioned: Cassidy's Website Cassidy on LinkedIn Cassidy on Twitter Jumblie - Word Game React Router Mistborn Trilogy by Brandon Sanderson Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Obie Fernandez: Pioneering AI in Ruby on Rails Development 44:11

47 weeks ago44:11

44:11

In this episode of the Maintainable Software Podcast, Robby speaks with Obie Fernandez , Chief Scientist at Olympia , about the integration of AI into modern software development. Obie shares his unique perspective on leveraging AI to enhance the maintainability and functionality of software applications, particularly in the Ruby on Rails ecosystem. Episode Highlights [00:01:00] Characteristics of Well-Maintained Software : Obie emphasizes the importance of test coverage and the role of Ruby in writing readable, maintainable code. [00:02:00] AI Integration Challenges : Delving into the complexities of working with external dependencies, Obie explains how he has tackled issues with OpenAI's API in the Olympia project. [00:05:50] Evals and Guardrails : Obie introduces the concept of evals and guardrails in AI-driven applications, detailing how they ensure robust and reliable software performance. [00:08:44] Account Management with AI : Learn about Obie's innovative "multitude of workers" approach to automating account management in Olympia using AI. [00:17:05] Obie's Upcoming Book : Obie discusses his forthcoming book, Patterns of Application Development Using AI , and shares the inspiration behind writing it. [00:21:52] Prompt Engineering Essentials : Explore the fundamentals of prompt engineering and how it plays a crucial role in AI-driven workflows. [00:22:48] Self-Healing Data and Intelligent Error Handling : Obie explains how AI can be used to enhance application robustness through self-healing data and intelligent error handling. [00:29:03] Human-Augmented AI in Olympia : Discover how Olympia's AI consultants are augmented by human expertise, creating a hybrid model that enhances service quality. [00:41:00] The Future of AI in Software Development : Obie reflects on the current AI revolution and draws parallels with the early days of Ruby on Rails, offering insights into the future of AI in software engineering. Key Takeaways The Role of Ruby in AI : Ruby's syntax and readability play a significant role in creating maintainable AI-driven applications. AI Integration Complexity : Handling external APIs and dependencies requires robust error management and creative solutions like evals and guardrails. Innovative Account Management : Obie's approach to AI-driven account management offers a glimpse into the future of business automation. AI's Impact on Software Development : AI has the potential to revolutionize software maintenance, making it more robust and adaptable. Resources Mentioned Obie's LinkedIn: Obie Fernandez Obie's Twitter: @obie Obie's Blog: Medium Olympia Upcoming Book: Patterns of Application Development Using AI by Obie Fernandez Science Fiction Recommendation: Ian Banks' Books Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Tekin Süleyman: Balancing Complexity and Team Size 42:31

48 weeks ago42:31

42:31

Topics Discussed Characteristics of Well-Maintained Software : Tekin emphasizes the importance of software that is easy to change and tailored to the team's needs. Balancing Complexity and Team Size : Tekin discusses how his small team manages complexity and features to maintain sustainable work practices without overburdening the developers. GovUK Project Insights : Tekin shares his experiences working on the GovUK project, highlighting the challenges and breakthroughs in rationalizing the UK's government digital real estate. Version Control Best Practices : Tekin and Robby delve into the importance of well-written Git commit messages and how they preserve institutional knowledge. Connecting with End Users : Tekin advocates for developers to get closer to end users to better understand their needs and deliver more effective solutions. Key Takeaways Maintaining software sustainability is crucial, especially for small teams. Intentional decisions about growth and complexity can prevent burnout and maintain productivity. Direct interaction with end users can significantly improve software quality and usability. Effective version control practices help preserve valuable institutional knowledge. Organizations should balance parallel work to avoid overburdening development teams. Resources Mentioned GovUK GitHub Repository Programming as Theory Building by Peter Nauer User Story Mapping by Jeff Patton A Branch in Time (a story about revision histories) Tekin on Ruby.social Join Together Cooperative Book Recommendation: Palestine +100: Stories from a Century After the Nakba Don't miss this insightful conversation with Tekin Süleyman as he shares his journey and best practices for maintaining sustainable software within small teams. Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error-tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Use the code maintainable to get a 10% discount for your first year. Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Ryosuke Iwanaga: The Benefits of Cell-Based Architecture 42:26

49 weeks ago42:26

42:26

Ryosuke shares his insights on: Ownership in Software Maintenance: The role of single-threaded ownership and dedicated teams in maintaining software and shared libraries. Technical Debt: How his definition of technical debt has evolved over the years and strategies to manage it effectively. Monitoring and Alarming: The importance of comprehensive monitoring and alarming systems in handling legacy software and ensuring reliability. Change Management: Best practices for change management, including preparing for worst-case scenarios and automating processes to reduce risks. Phased Rollouts and Feature Flags: Implementing phased rollouts and using feature flags to manage changes safely and gradually. Cell-Based Architecture: How cell-based architecture enhances scalability and reliability, and the challenges of maintaining multi-cell systems. Operational Excellence: Continuous deployment, regular dashboard reviews, and technologies used in orchestration to achieve operational excellence. Ryosuke also discusses his current role and responsibilities as a software engineer and his consulting work with OpsVL, where he helps organizations raise their operational standards. Resources Mentioned Ryosuke Iwanaga on LinkedIn OpsBR Software Technology Inc. Cell-Based Architecture Tune in to this insightful episode to learn more about maintaining healthy and scalable software systems. About the Guest: Ryosuke Iwanaga is the President of OpsBR Software Technology Inc. He has extensive experience in software engineering, including roles in sales engineering, support engineering, and data center operations. Ryosuke is passionate about operational excellence and helping organizations improve their software systems. Follow Ryosuke on Social Media: LinkedIn Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Julia Ferraioli - Capturing Untold Open Source Stories 47:32

50 weeks ago47:32

47:32

Welcome to the Maintainable Software Podcast! In this episode, Robby speaks with Julia Ferraioli, an Open Source AI/ML Strategist at AWS and co-founder of Open Source Stories. Julia joins us from Seattle, Washington, and shares her insights into the world of open source, AI, and software maintainability. Key Topics: Well-Maintained Software: Julia shares her thoughts on the characteristics of well-maintained software, emphasizing the importance of avoiding "clever" code that is often unmaintainable. Creative vs. Assembly Process: The discussion touches on the balance between software as a creative endeavor and an assembly process, highlighting the need for maintainability. Ternary Operators and Readability: Julia provides her perspective on the use of ternary operators and how certain programming language features can impact code readability and maintainability. Open Source Stories: Julia discusses the origins and goals of Open Source Stories, a narrative project that captures the untold stories of open-source contributors. Challenges in Open Source: The episode delves into the challenges faced by open source contributors, including cultural context, erasure, and the lack of exit interviews. Research and Software Maintenance: Julia's background in machine learning research offers a unique perspective on the intersection of research and software maintenance. Technical Debt: A broader definition of technical debt is explored, encompassing work deferred and cultural issues within organizations. Effective Strategies: Julia shares strategies for addressing technical debt and navigating conversations about prioritizing technical improvements. Metrics and Developer Experience: The importance of context in metrics and the value of developer experience feedback are discussed. AI/ML Tools: Julia provides her predictions on the impact of AI/ML tools on software maintenance in the coming years. Resources Mentioned: Open Source Stories Feminism is for Everybody by Bell Hooks Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Tanmai Gopal: Unlocking the Potential of Unified APIs 44:39

51 weeks ago44:39

44:39

In this episode of Maintainable, Robby Russell sits down with Tanmai Gopal, the CEO and co-founder of Hasura . Tanmai shares his insights into the characteristics of well-maintained software and the importance of a codebase that no team member fears. He emphasizes the need for accessibility and understandability in code, making it easier for developers to work with and iterate upon. Tanmai dives deep into the metaphor of technical debt, urging teams to prioritize product outcomes over best practices. He highlights the value of addressing technical debt contextually and in a way that aligns with product goals. A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the concept of the "super graph" in GraphQL. Tanmai explains how a unified API, created through federated GraphQL, can streamline API integration and reduce latency. He compares GraphQL with RESTful APIs, showcasing the advantages of a graph-based approach for handling complex data relationships. Tanmai also introduces Hasura's platform, which introspects databases, code, and APIs to create a comprehensive super graph. This platform simplifies API management, making it easier for developers to maintain and evolve their applications. Listeners will also learn about Hasura's upcoming user conference and the new features they plan to unveil. Tanmai shares his top science fiction book recommendations and where to follow his thoughts on software engineering online. Key Takeaways: The importance of a fearless codebase for well-maintained software. Strategies to improve code accessibility and understandability. The metaphor of technical debt and its contextual importance. The concept and benefits of a super graph in GraphQL. How Hasura simplifies API management through introspection. Upcoming Hasura user conference and new features. Resources Mentioned: Hasura Tanmai Gopal on LinkedIn N.K. Jemisin's Broken Earth Trilogy Naomi Novik's Uprooted Martha Wells' Murderbot Diaries Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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James Socol: Building Social Capital in Engineering Teams 44:18

52 weeks ago44:18

44:18

In this episode of the Maintainable Software Podcast, Robby Russell sits down with James Socol, a Staff Engineer at Fastly, to discuss the art of maintaining legacy code and the nuances of technical debt versus technical depreciation. Key Topics Discussed: Characteristics of Well-Maintained Code: James shares his insights on what defines well-maintained code, emphasizing the importance of continuous maintenance, testing, and encapsulation. Technical Debt vs. Technical Depreciation: James introduces the concept of technical depreciation, distinguishing it from technical debt and explaining how time affects software maintenance. Balancing Old and New Patterns: The discussion explores the challenges of integrating modern standards into legacy systems and finding a healthy balance. 20% Time for Maintenance: James advocates for dedicating a portion of engineering capacity to maintenance tasks, drawing parallels to Google's 20% time concept. Onboarding Strategies: James offers valuable advice for new hires, emphasizing observation, gradual involvement, and building social capital within the team. Continuous Delivery and Big Changes: Insights into managing significant changes in a continuous delivery environment, with practical strategies for maintaining stability. Resources Mentioned: Riot Engineering Blog: A Taxonomy of Tech Debt Silicon Valley Product Group Laura Hogan's Donut Theory Books: Getting to Yes by Roger Fisher & William Ury Turn the Ship Around by L. David Marquet Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Paola Ducolin: Building Trust and Communication in Engineering Teams 45:30

1 year ago45:30

45:30

In this episode of Maintainable, Robby chats with Paola Ducolin, Staff Engineer at Datadog . Paola shares her insights on the characteristics of well-maintained software, the common struggles teams face, and effective strategies for working with stakeholders to prioritize refactoring. Key Topics Discussed: Characteristics of Maintainable Software : Paola explains the importance of well-documented code and having tests that automatically detect breaks. Challenges in Maintaining Software : The impact of business pressures on maintaining code quality and how teams can navigate these challenges. Working with Stakeholders : Strategies for communicating the importance of refactoring and measuring the impact of technical debt on business objectives. Role of Staff Engineers : Paola’s journey to becoming a staff engineer and the responsibilities that come with the role, including coordination and networking. Documentation and Design Systems : The power of documentation and how design systems can serve as a model for well-documented and maintainable code. Observability and Monitoring : An overview of Datadog's tools for observability and monitoring, and how they help in maintaining software quality. Resources Mentioned: Datadog My Path to Staff Engineer Sarah Drasner: The Art of Code Comments Book Recommendations Radical Candor Crucial Conversations Be sure to follow Paola on LinkedIn and stay tuned for more insightful conversations on Maintainable. Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Robin Heinze - React Native and the Art of Flexibility 40:35

1 year ago40:35

40:35

In this episode, Robby welcomes Robin Heinze, Director of Engineering at Infinite Red, to discuss the intricacies of building and maintaining robust software systems. Key topics covered include: Characteristics of Maintainable Software: Robin shares insights from her team on what makes software maintainable, emphasizing the need for clear documentation, robust setup scripts, and ongoing code refinement. Technical Debt: They delve into managing technical debt, particularly in a consultancy setting, and how to balance client expectations with software quality. React Native: Robin explains the advantages of using React Native for cross-platform development, highlighting its efficiency and accessibility to a broader range of developers. Consultancy Challenges: The conversation also covers the unique aspects of working in a consultancy, including how to embed standards while respecting client processes. Major Takeaways: Effective communication and a proactive approach to maintenance are crucial in software development. Visual elements like graphics can significantly enhance the accessibility and appeal of open source projects. Book Recommendation: A Thursday Murder Club Mystery Series by Richard Osman Helpful Links: React Native Infinite Red Chain React Conference React Native Radio Podcast For more insights, make sure to follow Robin on: LinkedIn Twitter Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Scott Hanselman - The Fear Factor in Maintainable Software 36:35

1 year ago36:35

36:35

In this episode of Maintainable, Robby welcomes Scott Hanselman, VP of Developer Community at Microsoft and host of the Hanselminutes Podcast, to discuss the emotional side of maintainable software. Scott shares his thoughts on fear as a common thread in poorly maintained software, the importance of building a team culture of trust, and how finding a good work-life balance helps create better software. The Role of Fear in Technical Debt Scott believes that if you fear the software you work on, it's a tell-tale sign that it has maintainability issues. Technical debt is rooted in fear--either fear of making a change that will break something or fear of being unable to change something when needed. He encourages teams to talk openly about their fears and anxieties regarding the software and to consider what things give them confidence in the codebase. Building a Team Culture of Confidence Scott emphasizes the importance of empathy in overcoming technical debt and making software more maintainable. Senior engineers and team leads have a responsibility to make junior developers feel safe enough to speak up and ask questions. He advocates for providing new hires with small, achievable tasks to build their confidence and trust in the software. Scott encourages teams to use "inner loop" and "outer loop" thinking. Inner loop - The cycle of making a change, hitting f5, and seeing changes immediately. Outer loop - Things like deploying the codebase, getting it tested, ensuring production stability. Both experienced and junior engineers have their own inner and outer loops as individuals, and continuous improvement at all levels is key. Overcoming Fear, Embracing Maintainability, and Finding Balance Scott shares stories about Microsoft's journey with open-source software and how that process has shaped the company's culture around maintainable code. He talks about the importance of striking a balance between source-opened and open-source software and finding the sweet spot for a project or organization. Scott warns against the trap of striving for unattainable perfection. Aiming for good, solid repeatable work over perfection ultimately yields better results. He uses his own projects, like the Hanselminutes podcast, as examples of focusing on consistent outputs and utilizing a simple workflow. Scott advocates for using AI tools to transcribe coding sessions, freeing up developers from extensive note-taking. Book Recommendation: The Daily Stoic By Ryan Holiday Scott Hanselman - Personal Website Hanselminutes Podcast .NET Open Source History: .NET Core | Microsoft Learn Helpful Links: Scott Hanselman - Personal Website Hanselminutes Podcast .NET Open Source History: .NET Core | Microsoft Learn Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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1
Stig Brautaset: Understanding Alien Artifacts in Legacy Code 46:04

1 year ago46:04

46:04

In this episode of Maintainable, Robby chats with Stig Brautaset, Staff Software Engineer at CircleCI. Stig shares his insights on maintaining well-documented but complex legacy code, the impact of team dynamics on software maintenance, and his experiences with the SBJSON library. Stig discusses the characteristics of well-maintained software, emphasizing the importance of team experience, domain knowledge, and risk appetite. He reflects on his own career journey, highlighting the transition from overconfidence to a balanced approach to risk-taking. A significant portion of the conversation delves into Stig's concept of "Alien Artifacts," which describes highly resistant legacy code written by highly skilled engineers. He explains the challenges of modifying such code and shares examples from his own experiences. Stig also talks about his work on the SBJSON library, addressing the complexities of handling multiple versions and dependency conflicts. He advocates for developers maintaining the software they ship and discusses the balance between shipping features quickly and maintaining long-term code quality. Key Takeaways The influence of team dynamics on software maintenance Understanding the concept of "Alien Artifacts" in legacy code Strategies for handling multiple versions of a software library The importance of developers being on call for the software they ship Managing different types of technical debt Book Recommendation: The Scout Mindset by Julia Galef Stig Brautaset on LinkedIn Alien Artifacts Blog Post SBJSON Library CircleCI The Confident Commit Podcast Helpful Links: Stig Brautaset on LinkedIn Alien Artifacts Blog Post SBJSON Library CircleCI The Confident Commit Podcast Want to share your thoughts on this episode? Reach out to Robby at robby@maintainable.fm. Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Brit Myers - Decoding Product vs. Technical Risk 42:20

1 year ago42:20

42:20

Join Robby as he welcomes Brit Myers to the podcast. Brit, currently thriving as the VP of Engineering at System Initiative, discusses the intricacies of maintaining software. She emphasizes the importance of navigable software, where the ease of tracing the code and understanding its structure is paramount. Brit highlights the significance of clear naming conventions and inline documentation, as they help in maintaining a cohesive narrative within the software. The conversation touches on the challenges posed by discrepancies in vocabulary between product management and engineering, and how glossaries can bridge these communication gaps. Brit advocates for the use of glossaries more as a reflective tool rather than a proactive one, given the dynamic nature of software development. She also delves into strategies for managing legacy code and technical debt, proposing a pragmatic approach where wrapping and modularizing legacy components can mitigate risks. She discusses the balance between immediate feature delivery and long-term code health, stressing the importance of aligning technical risks with business objectives. The episode explores the impact of company culture on development practices, the benefits of synchronous work environments, and the evolving landscape of DevOps. Tune in to tap into Brit’s valuable wisdom. Book Recommendation: Crucial Conversations: Tools for Talking When Stakes are High By Kerry Patterson, Stephen R. Covey, Joseph Grenny, Ron McMillan, and Al Switzler Helpful Links: System Initiative Brit on LinkedIn SPACE Framework DORA metrics Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

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Andrea Guarino - Leveraging Static Analysis for Better Code 36:18

1 year ago36:18

36:18

In this episode, Robby interviews Andrea Guarino, a Software Engineer at Sonar, about the importance of leveraging static analysis tools for maintaining clean and adaptable code. Andrea emphasizes that well-maintained software should be easy to change, consistent, intentional, and responsible. He explains that static analysis tools play a crucial role in identifying potential issues, ensuring code quality, and preventing security leaks. Andrea also highlights the importance of educating developers on these best practices and integrating such tools into the development workflow to uphold a high standard of code quality. He discusses the challenges of maintaining consistency in code, especially when dealing with legacy code written in different periods and by different teams. Andrea also touches on the concept of technical debt, suggesting a pragmatic approach to address it by balancing between new code quality and gradual improvements to legacy code. Stay tuned for that and more! Book Recommendation: The Brothers Karamazov by Fyodor Dostoevsky Helpful Links: Andrea on LinkedIn Sonar Personal Website Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

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Staffan Nöteberg - On the Power of Monotasking in Software Development 46:54

1 year ago46:54

46:54

In this insightful episode, we dive deep into the essence of software maintainability with Agile Coach and author Staffan Nöteberg. Unpacking the layers of what it takes for software to be considered well-maintained, Staffan sheds light on the crucial roles of abstraction and modularity. These foundational elements not only make software easier to understand for newcomers but also ensure that it can evolve and adapt over time without becoming bogged down by complexity. The conversation takes a pivotal turn towards the often misunderstood concept of technical debt. With Staffan's expertise, listeners gain a nuanced understanding of why technical debt is more than just a buzzword - it's a crucial aspect of software development that requires careful communication, especially with those in management positions. This leads into an exploration of monotasking as a transformative approach to productivity. Unlike the common practice of juggling multiple tasks, monotasking focuses on dedicating one's attention to the most critical task at hand, thereby enhancing efficiency and output quality. Further enriching the discussion, Staffan introduces the concept of panorama sessions. These are strategic moments set aside to reassess and prioritize tasks, ensuring that efforts are always aligned with the most impactful objectives. Such strategies not only streamline the development process but also foster a more collaborative and agile workplace. As the episode unfolds, listeners are invited to reflect on their own practices and consider how embracing a monotasking approach could revolutionize their work and the software they develop. For those looking to dive deeper into the principles discussed and discover practical strategies for applying them, Staffan Nöteberg's book, "Monotasking," comes highly recommended. It's a resource that promises to change how you view productivity and software development. Book Recommendation: Complexity: The Emerging Science at the Edge of Order and Chaos by M. Mitchell Waldrop Helpful Links: Monotasking by Staffan Nöteberg Pomodoro Technique Illustrated by Staffan Nöteberg Regular Expressions - The Full Story Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Martin Emde - Ruby Central and the Art of Being Tolerant to Change 52:47

1 year ago52:47

52:47

In this episode of Maintainable, our host Robby Russell sits down with Martin Emde , a sage in the Ruby community and the current Director of Open Source at Ruby Central . Together, they weave through the intricacies of maintainable software, legacy code, and the unwavering power of the Ruby ecosystem. Martin, with his wealth of experience, shares tales from the trenches of open-source software development, focusing on RubyGems and Bundler , and how they've evolved to face the challenges of modern software needs. Martin addresses the elephant in the room - complexity in software. He muses on the natural progression of software projects from simplicity to complexity, drawing parallels to the growth of living organisms. It's not about fighting complexity, but embracing it with open arms, ensuring the software remains adaptable and maintainable. This conversation sheds light on the importance of testing, documentation, and community support in navigating the seas of complex software development. Diving deeper, they discuss the essence of technical debt, not as a villain in our stories but as a necessary step in the rapid evolution of technology. Martin's perspective on technical debt as a tool for progress rather than an obstacle is refreshing, encouraging developers to approach their work with more kindness and understanding. The discussion also highlights Ruby Central's pivotal role in nurturing the Ruby community, emphasizing the importance of contributions, whether code, conversation, or financial support. Martin's call to action for developers to engage with open-source projects, to adopt gems in need, and to provide support where possible, is a heartwarming reminder of the collective effort required to sustain the vibrant Ruby ecosystem. For those curious minds eager to dive into the world of Ruby, contribute to its growth, or simply enjoy a captivating discussion on software development, this episode is a delightful journey through the challenges and joys of maintaining open-source software. Don't miss out on the gems of wisdom shared in this episode, and be sure to check out the useful links below for more information on how you can contribute to the Ruby community. Book Recommendation: Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir Helpful Links: Bundler Ruby Central Adopt a Gem Martin on Github Martin's website Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Esther Olatunde - AI's Role in Evolving Software Engineering Practices 47:39

1 year ago47:39

47:39

In this captivating episode of the Maintainable Software Podcast, host Robby Russell delves deep with Esther Olatunde, Senior Product Engineer at Intercom, into the realms of software maintenance, technical debt, and the impact of AI on software development. The discussion kicks off with Esther's insights on what constitutes well-maintained software, emphasizing the importance of quality from both the user's and developer's perspectives. They explore how ease of onboarding for new developers and the ability to swiftly navigate codebases significantly contribute to a project's maintainability. The conversation then shifts towards the nuances of managing technical debt, with Esther sharing her evolved understanding of the term over her career. From her early days in startups to her current role at Intercom, she provides a rich perspective on the challenges and strategies for advocating maintenance work within diverse organizational sizes. This episode takes an intriguing turn as Robby and Esther speculate on the future of software engineering in the age of AI, pondering how tools like GitHub Copilot could redefine the developer's role. Robby probes into the potential of AI in accelerating development processes and the implications for software quality and team dynamics. They also touch upon the critical aspect of advocating for maintenance tasks to non-developers, underscoring the long-term benefits over immediate functionality gains. The episode is peppered with practical advice for engineers at all levels, encouraging them to persistently champion the cause of addressing technical debt for healthier codebases. As a bonus, Esther recommends a non-technical yet profoundly relevant book, "Built" by Tony Fadell, which offers insights into product development and innovation, further enriching the discussion with broader perspectives on creating meaningful and lasting technology. Dive into this episode for a thorough exploration of the intricacies of software maintenance, the evolving landscape of software development, and how to navigate the challenges of technical debt, all through the lens of an experienced software engineer at the forefront of the industry. Helpful Links: Esther's Website Esther on LinkedIn Esther on GitHub Intercom GitHub Copilot "Built" by Tony Fadell Thanks to Our Sponsor! Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out! Subscribe to Maintainable on: Apple Podcasts Spotify Or search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts. Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.…

Maintainable

1
Robbie Wagner - Whiskey, Front-End, and Whatnot 40:02

1 year ago40:02